GhR cheat tests in the upcoming season.

[crypt]

http://macgamingleague.com/index.php?iguard

This takes care of the RvS problem.

Is it just me, or do what I get out of ghost.fr's post mean that he has these cheats? I'm trying to decipher it, but I just can't.

[theweakspot]

yeah, i cant find the thread but there was one where he explained how to join Mac via a PC and also said that he had a way to show everyone on the map.

[cO.twist]

weak - the way to handle that would be to do a cheat test at the beginning..on a random map in a random location, and wait to send the ss's until after the cb is over.

[Civrock]

He talks about a hack where the entire map is sensored from the beginning till the end.  For a game where strategic positioning is a mayor factor, i believe that this hack is as serious as the "no-recoil" hack in RVS.
I suggest you talk to Ghost, he is a smart man and already devoted alot of time in trying to get rid of cheats in Ghr .

negative, it's not a sensor hack which shows the entire map from the begnning till the end. i did talk with him for a while some weeks ago and looked at how his mentioned "cheats" work and it's a simple mapskin "trick" which can be easily seen in a cheattest. also, it doesnt work on all maps. it rather destroys the game for the "cheater" and makes it almost unplayable, instead of giving a real advantage. i'm not going to say more to give people ideas to experiment.

The biggest problem is that there is ALWAYS a workaround, especially wihtout a real PB.  I mean, who is to say that we have a cheat test where you have to take a SS at the beginning of the match.  If  I'm a cheater I just have two versions of GhR on my drive or i swap folders.  I use my 'clean' one to take the SS, but once we rejoin i usee my corrupt version.

that's not allowed, though, logically. after a cheattest there is no rejoining. if you crash or leave in or short after a cheattest, you're getting warning points according to the BL rules.

We would have to take SSs at random points in the CB and spend time sending them back and forth.  Frankly, i won't have the patience for that shit.  If I don't trust you to the point where I have to openly question if you are hacking, well, then I shouldn't be cbing you in the first place.

If GhR has devolved because of all this RvS crap then fuck it.  Count me out.  Sorry.

well, as much as i'd like to agree... this is a competitive league, though, where clans are supposed to CB as many different clans as possible, as often as possible. it's of course easy to say that you only want to play with people you trust, yeah... but this is why there are cheattests. you don't even have to do it in the beginning, each clan can choose randomly in a CB when to call for one which both have to do (only one per CB, not once per clan per CB, that's not necessary). the SS's get exchanged AFTER the CB is done and checked and that's it. it's not a very long procedure and i personally don't have a problem doing it regularly to be sure there's no cheating involved by anyone, as much as i trust people (and i'm not a paranoid person at all).
don't stop gaming because of this, it's not worth it. don't let the cheaters destroy the game for you and keep playing. if there are any cheaters, and i don't think there are many in GhR, if any at all. they're either really stupid to continue using them from now on or they'll get caught, my word in god's ears, i'm not going to let this happen to GhR. advanced cheattests are a good thing.

BTW... FtF should be on gameranger soon, according to Evill... fun game even though its not tactical... small maps, runs on a toaster (G3) but more than anything... its fun and has punkbuster.  Can't wait.

yeah, i hope so too. the game and its requirements are great to become a very popular game on GR (although there could be more MP maps) but it's been a while again since that has been said... so... we should get a new statement on FtF and GR.

yeah, i cant find the thread but there was one where he explained how to join Mac via a PC and also said that he had a way to show everyone on the map.

ah yeah... his way to join with a PC. first you'd need a PC (which i know 99% of the people here don't have), several 3rd party applications (which you first have to know, and the how to use them) and be a really pathetic asshole to do this stupid procedure before every CB, as far as ghost.fr explained it to me, only to cheat in GhR with a PC.[/color]

[[:] Mr. T]

I think it's a great idea and I don't have any problem with it. In fact, I encourage it. Of course there are workarounds (as Weak mentioned), but it seem like with the SS idea that the benefits of cheating are out weighed by the hassel of doing it... or so it would seem. I guess the allure of being seen as some all-pwning GhR God is just so attractive to some pathetic players.

So... editing the command maps and reticules is cool, but swapping other graphics files (skins, textures, etc.) that provide a substantial advantage is not. I totally agree, but what about sound files? I'll freely admit that I have removed 3 or 4 sound files from the game to improve my hearing ability -- for example, the steady rain on Vilnius. Do people think that's cheating?? I hope not... I certainly don't think it is. I'd say the only advantage it gives me is that I can hear someone if they are within 5-10 meters while they might not be able to hear me. It's not like it helps me find players, anticipate a manuver or direct my team to an opponent.

It also keeps me from getting a headache... that rain drives me crazy on long matches.

Thoughts?

[Civrock]

i agree, i have some very annoying soundfiles removed myself. it's just as much advantage as a good reticule or command map would give you, nothing else. also, this couldn't be checked by a cheattest anyway.

[:MoD:Shade]

Part of me believes that the game should be played the way it came without modifications whatsoever - but I know it's easily modifyable so there's nothing stoping people from experimenting.

[Dark uk]

I don't think user made rets should be allowed to be used because some can give the player an advantage. Some of [01] had afew differnt rets and they didn't really make much of a differnt they just looked cool but they were soon deleted as part of a tourny's rules so obviously you must be able to get some rets that help or else the tounry wouldn't have had the rule in place.

I think the ss's are a good idea as long as no one is allowed to leave the cb once the ss's have been taken. I think the Screen shots should be taken after the lag test. Command Maps are fine though I think.

[[:] Mr. T]

Not leaving after the SS test is going to be a real point of contention. I personally don't seem to have a lot of voice issues, but there are player who do (both with premium and NF... or w/e). Most clans are patient and fair about letting people jump out and come back in to fix a dropped voice connection, but that defeats the whole SS test. A person could claim they lost voice and jump out, activate their hax and come back in.

I guess calling a SS test on a close or deciding game would be in order here, but we played a CB the other night with a clan that had a player drop out every game (i'm not saying they were cheating... it's just an example of the issue). If we had asked for a SS after each player left and came back we'd still be playing and people would have really started to get pissed off.

I guess there's just no way around it... these people have to fuck up the fun for the rest of us.

[Croosch]

rets should be a allowed as long as the trail of the bullet is not effected... all a reticule is, is a picture and I have nothing against that...

heh, yea sorry about that T, I had some wicked connection problems... which is why cell took my spot

But he does have a point... I've been crashing a lot lately and with that in mind I wouldn't even be able to cb with fright of getting my clan banned due to warning points from dropping out of a game... that'd sorta piss me off if I never got the chance to cb

[BFG]

- could an observer viewing the player see if they were using these hacks/cheats? - what im getting at would be a suggestion that CB rooms have a extra open slot to allow admins to randomly join (would need to sort the pw issue) and check up on players at any time - random hits if you like.

[Croosch]

I think it'd only be fair if the players in the game agree, I'de like to think they hold trust in every admin... but I understand if they don't want people observing their game.

and... would you see the same thing they see as an observer? if somebody is cheating they've mofied their game... since yours wouldn't be modified I would assume you would see whatever your game has the ability to show you.

[[:] Mr. T]

heh, yea sorry about that T, I had some wicked connection problems... which is why cell took my spot

That or your hax were giving you trouble :-)

I was trying to let you be anonymous and not say who or what clan!

[BTs_GhostSniper]

- could an observer viewing the player see if they were using these hacks/cheats? - what im getting at would be a suggestion that CB rooms have a extra open slot to allow admins to randomly join (would need to sort the pw issue) and check up on players at any time - random hits if you like.

I don't think they would be able to see the cheats themselves as an observer.  Most of the cheats used are only going to be seen by the person using them.  The observer might be able to notice kills that shouldn't be possible, but it would be hard to prove something like that.  The only real way to see the cheat is by making that person take a screen shot.

[BFG]

okey dokey - thus also not showing up on the replays - hmmm, kinda inportant to know what these hacks are and how they work and in what shape or form inorder to really know how they can be combated.

[legendrob]

Ya, the more i hear about cheating on here, the less I want to do cb's, I personally dont believe that any one clan as a whole is cheating but maybe a few players in certain clans are, and that will bring down the clan as a whole. I also agree, after some conciderable thought, that yes, maybe taking a ss, would be a waste of time, but recording every game would solve that, you would get a true view of what every player is useing. Now doing this to becomes a problem, some people would use this to their advantage by seing stratagies. So i guess youll have to decide whats more important. I love playing with all these guys on here and it just really blows to think that anyone would want to cheat just to win nothing really. Remember guys, this is for fun, not for money. Getting caught cheating will brand you forever here so it really doent seem worth the effort now does it. I sure hope that there is a resolve to this problem soon because it really does suck.

[H e L L B e N T]

Maybe it's just me, but doesn't this seem like it's all getting out of hand? The pregame cheat tests, mid game cheat tests, post game cheat tests and the cheat test cheat tests.

I mean hell, CBs now revolve around their cheat tests...

I just came back from a long GR absence, and this is partly why. I don't alter my game sound files because that's how the map is supposed to be played. Part of the visual aspect of Vilnius is the rain, so why remove the audio that goes with it? Not that I can change anyones mind about that but it's worth mentioning, if there's rain being shown on the screen you should hear it... I think the random explosions at Embassy are stupid though...

Anyway back to the point, is there no way to create a mod that locks all of these possible cheats? This "OMG he's a cheater, she's a cheater, that clans a cheater" shit is annoying no doubt, but the clan to clan paranoia is pretty stupid to. Some people used to get offended when one team would ask for a cheat test...  It would be great if there was a way to force players / teams to use the unaltered files without interrupting the flow of a good cb with "meet here, take SS now blah blah blah" it just seems to be taking away from the fun of the game in it's own serious way.

[z][t-Rampage]

- could an observer viewing the player see if they were using these hacks/cheats? - what im getting at would be a suggestion that CB rooms have a extra open slot to allow admins to randomly join (would need to sort the pw issue) and check up on players at any time - random hits if you like.

its a really good idea though. can someone who cheats come out and tell us if the cheats are visible to others? he he he. SS is a good way to do it too. they where effective when we did it before. z][t are more than happy to return to using cheat tests.

"negative, it's not a sensor hack which shows the entire map from the begnning till the end. i did talk with him for a while some weeks ago and looked at how his mentioned "cheats" work and it's a simple mapskin "trick" which can be easily seen in a cheattest. also, it doesnt work on all maps. it rather destroys the game for the "cheater" and makes it almost unplayable, instead of giving a real advantage. i'm not going to say more to give people ideas to experiment."


back to ghost. i'm not getting why there is a question about him. if someone is wondering about his character, send him a pm. he is a gentleman and he is a stand up guy who pretty much stopped playing ghr because of cheats. if he has cheats to look into cheats, i wouldnt know. dunno how that works. Civic, im still not understanding how ghost's attempts to tell people about cheaters is being belitled by you. cheats are cheats no matter how they are made, what game they are for or who does it. i think its "uncool" to "not" give "simple" credit to a "person" who has taken the "time" to "tell" the "community" about a "valid" problem that should have been "dealt" with long ago. unless i am "missunderstanding" your comments on his "efforts"?

and i do agree with not giving people too many ideas
 

[Vir2L:SOG]

IMO, removing specific sound files (rain, wind, etc) to enhance your hearing, is cheating.

And yes the loud wind and rain annoys all of us, but it is a part of the game that wasn't meant to be altered to enhance ones hearing.  There is a reason the sounds are there, to submerge the player into the environment, and make he/she feel like they are actually in a real place.  You people are removing the environment from the game.

I'm sure some of you will disagree, and this is mearly my opinion, but other hardcore gamers will agree that you are enhancing/altering gameplay to favor you, ala cheating.

[cO.Vickedson]

Sorry T, I would say you should put all sound files back in....especially sounds like rain and waterfalls.  They're in the game for a reason.  

Just my 2 cents.

V