Clarification of BL Rules concerning Warzone

[BFG]

LOL. Heavens above, all i wanted was some clarification for Mauti or one of the guys who actually wrote these rules. Surely by the number of posts that have been written following my quiery there is a certain level of confusion as to how things stand regarding WZ.


btw. at the time that my confusion arose we were playing WZ on Airbase. 2v1 with less than 3minutes left. Now all the 1 man had to do (if the rules were not as i suspected) is sit tight and camp it out, the chances of the 2 guys on the other team of finding him are extreamly extreamly remote. - ie camping issues (which apparently WZ removes) are back in play

[Valdar]

LOL don't be so melodramtic BFG. Too many people start crying wolf whenever a tiny change happens. If a draw is so horrible to you, then you need to win more of the games beforehand. We all know that the draw is best for the team already winning. Above all, remember that this situation is so damn rare and the worse that happens to you is a DRAW.

[.vooDoo.]

lol, BFG i dont think any rule change is needed here. LMS/Warzone/Seige are all different styles of play with different ways of play. LMS isnt warzone just as much as seige isnt LMS. I think Noto's first Reply explains this very well.

?  In LMS, the goal is to eliminate all, if not more, of your opponents.  The team with the most players left alive is declared the winner, regardless of whether or not the other team was completely eliminated or not.  The only problem with LMS is camping, which was supposedly being taken care of with Warzone.

?  In Warzone, the goal is one of two objectives:  Control the Warzone for 3 minutes, or eliminate all opponents.  In the event that the game comes to an end by way of the game timer expiring, these two criteria are used to determine the winner.  Since the game timer only expires when the above criteria are not met, both teams are then informed that the game has resulted in a tie.

[BTs_GhostSniper]

Instead of having a separate Siege CB, could Siege be added to the regular GR Team CB just like WZ and LMS are now?

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Thanks VooDoo, now everyone has the answer from the BL =D.

BFG.GEN, yes, that game could have ended in a draw, but that also means that the team with 2 failed to take the base in the first 7 minutes (since only 3 were left).  And like someone said before, I haven't heard of a warzone draw yet (yours would be the first if it happened).

If neither team goes for the base, then it's their own fault that it ended in the draw.  Sounds like both teams camped, not just one.

[Saberian 3000]

Well, as for me accepting the issue isnt a problem.  What I have a problem with is why was this not written up in the rules?   I do understand that people need to experience an issue firsthand before it can be specified, but I do believe that this particular issue deserves at least some attention as to being put into the BL rules for future reference.  I believe that BFG was just flustered because we didnt know how it worked and were not aware of what action to take before hand because the rules, again, were not specified.  I believe thruout this whole query Noto and myself have calmly resolved any issue that we might have had within or game.  I think the issue for both of us is the fact that it has not been put into the BL rules.  
     I can also understand that WZ would be something quite hard to understand because even in testing the game u cant really test it with nothing to lose.  That is probably why this issue never ocurred before.  In either event, it was a big map, and i am sure we both camped a little.  But camping issues again, are not the issue.  If WZ is gonna be continued to be used then the rules of how it works should also be specified within the BL rules so people can understand exactly what the objectives are for gameplay.  
     Again, this is in no way a start for a flame war.  I am just expressing the concern that it seems all parties have about the BL rules at this point with WZ.  so if we could at least get some type of reply letting us know weather the specified rules for WZ are gonna be included then that would be most appreciated.  thanks.

+MOD+Saberian

[Acri]

I discovered a very important thing lately! Let me give you an example from the real world:

GhRa vs X1
2 vs 2 on team ladder
Map: Training, LMS

What happens is simple. I kill one of the X1s and then accidentaly blow myself up. There is now one guy in X1 and one in GhRa. These two open fire and both die. BOTH teams eradicated, GhR says we win!

Why: Since I killed myself, X1 only got 1 kill. Since both teams were eradicated GhRa got awarded the win due to the fact that we had TWO kills. We decided to replay the round since the rules kinda say this should be a draw? Anyhow, there are no hard feelings about the Cb but I want to know what really should happen in that situation?

Civic said GhRa deserved the win. Do all admins agree?

[Noto]

...These two open fire and both die. BOTH teams eradicated, GhR says we win!

Why: Since I killed myself, X1 only got 1 kill. Since both teams were eradicated GhRa got awarded the win due to the fact that we had TWO kills...

...Civic said GhRa deserved the win. Do all admins agree?

This situation was taken care of in Seaon 3 I believe.  I'm not going to bother looking for the post, but Civic is incorrect in his statement, which said it was a win due to the team kill.  

The ruling back at the end of Season 3 was that a team kill (TK) was actually a defensive advantage.  In a 2v2, 3v3, 4v4, etc., a team could simply start off my killing themselves, whether purposely or accidently, and having an advantage due to the fact that Ghost Recon still regards the game 0-0 since neither team had eliminated even a single enemy.  If you are in a 4v4 and someone TK's, it becomes a 4v3.  The team with 3 only has to kill one man to win (if time expires), but the other team has to kill one as well.  It's a lot easier, as we all know, to kill at least guy out of 4 than it is out of 3, hence the defensive advantage.  

Basically, what I'm trying to say, the final ruling was that a TK counts against the team who TK's because they are one man down.  General Game Rules : Rule 8 states that "...A tie is when both teams have the same number of players left alive at the end of the game...".  I know this does not state that a tie is also when both teams have been completely eliminated, but when no one is left alive, I think you can figure out the outcome of that one.

I hope that clears things up for you Acri.  It wouldn't make sense if you killed yourself, and won because of it, not matter what the game said.  And again, I disagree with Civic on this one.

.::|N| Noto

[Noto]

...And like someone said before, I haven't heard of a warzone draw yet (yours would be the first if it happened).

If neither team goes for the base, then it's their own fault that it ended in the draw.  Sounds like both teams camped, not just one.

To clear that situation up Buc, this scenario was actuall between .::|N| & +MOD+.  I believe this is how things went.  3v3 WZ on Airbase.  It was then 3v2 with +MOD+ leading, but then we evened things up.  We figured we should run out around 4 minutes remaining to try to get the Warzone.  We tried, and then got nailed just short of the smoke, without taking the Warzone.  It was then a 2v1 with +MOD+ on top again.  At this point, there were less then 3 minutes remaining.  Us .::|N| guys decided our last guy should just sit it out.  The reason why:  He couldn't take the Warzone since there were less than 3 minutes remaining.  In order to win, he would have had to eliminate the last 2 +MOD+ players in less than 3 minutes on a map that is quite big for a 2v1.  It was better to take a draw in this case, because if our guys attempted to go for the win, he would have most likely been shot before he even saw the first guy.  This is of course understandable.

In regards to never seeing a tie in Warzone, how has anyone never seen this before???  Go into a public room where you have Warzone with 4 respawns, and around 20 people playing.  You never take the Warzone because there are so many people, and it's sometimes difficult to completely eliminate the other team since there's always that one guy hiding in the bank or what not.  These games always end up in draws.  Now granted, it usually does not happen in a clan battle, but please do not insinuate that this is some sort of anomaly and that the planets must have been aligned in order for it to ensue.  Draws happen in Warzone, and it usually happens because you can't do anything about the Warzone in the last 3 mintues if it changes hands or was never taken, and it's sometimes difficult to find just one guy on large maps.  You end up running around in circles.

I would still like to see one of my statements added into the BL Rules though.  I clearly made two statements in an earlier post in this thread, and I think it would just clear this whole issue up.  Since Warzone is only addressed as a game type, with no specific rules, the rule change I ask for should have already been done, but since it has not, I still ask that it is done as soon as possible.

How many Admins do we have anyway?

.::|N| Noto

[Civrock]

hey,

i rechecked this issue and i have to agree with Noto. he?s right about that GhRa vs X1 problem... thank you for blaming me!  

[one] Civic.xo

[.vooDoo.]

To answer your question noto, there is Elandrion, Mauti, me, Infection, Hazard, Dr. No and now civic.

I think this issue is now resolved, pm me if you would like it reopened.