Open Letter to Posters

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Well, judging from what you say, the "reason" you have me ban because you don't like Rapid. So do you have AngryDad, Eric, Monk, and Skunkney ban? They're AK, so they're associated with Rapid who you don't like. . . Or is there more to it? Is it because I'm the PR guy, so I have to take the beating?

Way to not get it Typhy.  I don't have you banned at all and you damn well know it.  Deadeye banned you in the past, and I lifted it, as you damn well know.  So anything that starts with me having you banned is bullshit.  

If you are talking about Boycotting CB's or not even playing with AK, the AK clan, of which you are a part, is too often found in the center of trouble.  I, myself, chose to not play with AK's, and wont CB AK's, because I don't want to put up with the crap.  Like I said, look at your own web site and how it reccomends TK'ing people from Clans Rapid doesn't like.  All members from those clans.  So, as long as someone supports that and is associated with AK, I don't think I should be forced to associate with them.

I'll give you the ever popular nazi example.  If you were a neo-nazi, I'd chose not to associate with you.  Not because I thought you were as bad as Hitler.  But because you chose to associate yourself with him.  I'm not calling Rapid Hitler either, in this anology he'd just be the local head goose-stepper.  I'll give you another example.  If I was very against the catholic church, and you were a priest, why should I want to or be forced to associate with you.  (in that analogy, Rapid can be the pope).  It doesn't really matter what group you belong to.  If I don't agree in what your group does, how it acts, and who leads it, I don't have to associate with the group.  Same as store owners and resturants having the right of refusal of services.  They aren't public places, they are private property.  

You have the right to protest it and start a boycott of Ace's server.  But he's still not wrong.  You chose to make yourself part of that group, it's not like he has banned ex-AK's.

Hmm, that doesn't seem to be affecting us much. . .

Doesn't matter, and you missed the point.  The point is boycotting is a nice, peaceful way to demonstrate our disaproval.  It's not my fault, nor my concern that some people fall for childish insults and taunts that they are too afraid and using it as an excuse.  It's not an excuse.  I've only seen Rapid and Monk play GhR, and I wasn't impressed.  Rapid got his ass handed to him worse then Spaz.  So, I'm not afraid.  Maybe I just don't like him, or what I fell is the typical AK bullshit, and don't want to deal with it.  Gosh, maybe it's just that simple.

You show your lack of knowledge on this issue when you say that Jeb was the first one to boycott us,

Well, I stand corrected.  I was just trying not to take credit for an idea I posted that wasn't my own.  But I don't know IAM and will take your word that they were the first to boycott you.

So, like I said Typhy.  You don't have to agree with our reasons.  But I'm not a little kid that can be brought down by a little taunting either.  I have no respect for AK as a clan, and I have plenty of reasons, which we could talk about for a long time.  Since I have little to no respect for the clan, why should I play or CB with them?  Why should Ace let them on his server?

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Well, Loth did a pretty damn good job of pointing out most of the bullshit, but I just want to add a few more comments.

First off, good job on having better scores than me.  I wasn't saying I was smarter than you or anyone here, just that I'm no dumbass.

 

Way to skim.  Now, instead of looking at my scores, look at what I wrote about about them and what it doesn't prove.  Loth got it.

You say I'm a hypocrite for telling you not to insult people.  Calling you uncivil or an ass isn't an insult, it is saying the truth...you even accept those terms.  I'll stop calling you an asshole when you stop being an asshole.  (And I suppose you'll reply that you'll stop calling me a dumbass when I stop being a dumbass...but I've never been a dumbass other than in your mind).

I say you are a hypocrite because you have double standards.  I've pointed out examples and quoted the hell out of you insulting with no argument whatsoever.  I've pointed out and quoted your first post to Abe (which example you keep ignoring).  I call you a hypocrite because you are one.  Look at your own example.  You'll keep insulting me as long as you think I'm an asshole, but I shouldn't insult you even if I think you are a dumbass.  How is that not a double standard??  The reason I'm not a hypocrite is because I'm not crying "don't insult me".  You insult me, you insult others.  Then you admonish me for doing it.  I've given you plenty of examples in the past, want more?

I don't have the time nor desire to spend an hour researching every point in every post I make to see that you can't say anything about it.  

Actually, pointing out your mistakes takes no time at all.  It's pathetically easy all too often.  The part that usually takes the longest is flipping back a few pages to find the quote where you said what you are now disregarding.

Oh, and it's not like you only get one little point wrong, there are usually so many I have to pick and chose which ones to point out.

Don't you see that the weakness of a post is only an illusion.

Gawd, you are so full of it.  Of course Bondo, you are right.  Your posts are the very rock.  It's just a mirage that makes them look and smell like such bullshit.  How could I have been so blind?  

Wow, much sarcasim, but what the hell, when you say you make strong arguments then pull that kind of crap, I actually laughed my ass off.

Also, for me it has nothing to do with which side of the argument that you are on.  I don't treat one side different from the other.  Like I said about Zait, I take the point as a whole rather than taking it apart to see if there are any elements that aren't strong.  I do the same with opposing viewpoints, I take the overall point.

BULLSHIT.  WEAKSAUSE.  DUMBASS.  LIAR.  

You completely ignore the VAST ERRORS (I told you that statement was going to haunt you) in Zaitsev's posts, then refuse to read Abe's.  I've quoted you on it.  Do I need to show it to you again?

Also, just look above for another good example.  You talk about the grades and completely miss my point about them meaning nothing.  You didn't address my point at all, you ignored it completely, just repeating yours.

You hold one hell of a double standard.  For you and those that agree with you, you overlook their shortcomings, turn a blind eye to their insults, and require a lower standard of post.  (examples, Bander's insults, Zaitsev's bad writing and blatent errors), but say you wont read Abe's post, tell me you wont read all of mine because they are too long, complain about my style, complain about my insults (while you and Bander are free to insult), ok, do I really need to go on.

You never touch my real points or my examples Bondo.  You go around them.  That's one great example on why your arguments are weak.

[abe]

bah,

weaksauce, i still dont get why you cant get over the fact that people don't have a problem with your opinions, but with the way you argue them.

even if you are ultimately right about the issues, the fact that you possess the debating skills of a five-year old just makes it pointless discussing anything with you.

 lothario gave u some tips that you could also learn in english class or from a writing textbook....i suggest you keep them in mind next time you post. that way you could avoid being called a dumbass and participate meaningfully in the debate.

you have convinced me (didnt even take you long) that you are not only a mindless kneejerk-liberal, who doesnt think for himself, but also that youre a giant sissy for bitching like a little girl when people make fun of your half-assed logic and poor argumentative skills. this is why, in my opinion, you merit the label weaksauce and i will keep calling you that until you prove me wrong....and this thread and every whiney little reply of yours just convinces me even more that you that its a pretty apt description.

[The Ghost of Bondo]

Do you think you are better then us with a 3.7 GPA half way through college?

Way to skim your own post...you asked if I thought I was better than you.  I replied that I didn't.  And I noticed your point that it didn't have anything to do with being a dumbass.  But I also thought that was bullshit.  In my original point I specifically mentioned that if I couldn't make a logical argument like you claim I can't then I wouldn't have those grades.  So thus I was proving that I wasn't a dumbass because I make logical arguments.

I say you are a hypocrite because you have double standards.  I've pointed out examples and quoted the hell out of you insulting with no argument whatsoever.  I've pointed out and quoted your first post to Abe (which example you keep ignoring).  I call you a hypocrite because you are one.  Look at your own example.  You'll keep insulting me as long as you think I'm an asshole, but I shouldn't insult you even if I think you are a dumbass.  How is that not a double standard??  The reason I'm not a hypocrite is because I'm not crying "don't insult me".  You insult me, you insult others.  Then you admonish me for doing it.  I've given you plenty of examples in the past, want more?

I apologized to abe about that.  Also, I don't think you are an asshole, it is apparent fact and something you relish in...on the other hand my being a dumbass is completely subjective.  You really aren't reading if you think I'm admonishing you for insulting.  Insulting can be acceptable in a proper context.  I was saying insulting in the context of assing with everything else that goes along with assing is not acceptable.

Gawd, you are so full of it.  Of course Bondo, you are right.  Your posts are the very rock.  It's just a mirage that makes them look and smell like such bullshit.  How could I have been so blind?

I never claimed my posts were the only possible opinion.  There is a big difference between my posts not being weak which they aren't and being absolute, which they aren't.

You completely ignore the VAST ERRORS (I told you that statement was going to haunt you) in Zaitsev's posts, then refuse to read Abe's.  I've quoted you on it.  Do I need to show it to you again?

That had nothing to do with view.  Zait's was properly written with capitals, periods, and spaces between paragraphs.  And I did read abe's.  And I treated it exactly the same...I read all of it I could read (there was german and other oddities) and once again took the whole of it and didn't pick any detail out.  You say you've made an example to show that I'm wrong...but your example shows nothing at all

You hold one hell of a double standard.  For you and those that agree with you, you overlook their shortcomings, turn a blind eye to their insults, and require a lower standard of post.  (examples, Bander's insults, Zaitsev's bad writing and blatent errors), but say you wont read Abe's post, tell me you wont read all of mine because they are too long, complain about my style, complain about my insults (while you and Bander are free to insult), ok, do I really need to go on.

You never touch my real points or my examples Bondo.  You go around them.  That's one great example on why your arguments are weak.

I skim Bander's posts too because they are hard to read...and I don't pick out details about anyone's posts.  I complain about your insults because they are specific and repetitive and directed at me.  If Bander or anyone else insulted me constantly I'm sure I would complain.

There, I touched all the points you made.

[Ace]

Then there's Ace, who takes it to an extreme in the other direction. Wombat's reason for not liking Ace is much the same as mine for not liking his posts; "he argues with facts".

You don't like me because I use facts in my arguments. Hilarious, fucking hilarious. I'm truly at a loss for words on thise one.

As I adressed earlier. . . You're not doing a service to the community, you're doing a service to a selective group of your friends. Unban me and any others who you have ban for no reason, and I will accept it, and agree that you're doing a service for the community.

Typhy, I banned you and the rest of AK because, guess what, that's what is better for everyone as a whole. Sure it makes it suck for you people in AK, but it makes the games more enjoyable for everyone else because we don't have to deal with the inevitable bullshit and strife that accompanies AK. The only other people I ban are TK'ers because *shock* they make it suck for everyone else playing too. BTW, anyone who leaves AK will be unbanned from my server; just ask iRunx.

[Cossack]

Politics man, all politics.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

You thought the point was bullshit, but you ignored it in your post.  Another example of weaksause as Abe puts it.  You see, I know what you said in your post, which is why I said I know PhD's that are still dumbasses.  That kind of says that your proof is bullshit in my opinion.  It means that you have proven nothing.

I'll even give you a really, really good example here that even you can't deny.  You've called me a dumbass in the past (I'll go find it and post it here if you even try to deny it).  Well, according to you, I can't be a dumbass, because I have all those academic credentials.  So, either I can't be a dumbass, or your proof about grades and academics mean nothing.  

Now that was a strong, logical argument!

So, by apologizing to Abe ("I'm sorry for some of the things I said"), that means it didn't happen??  Wow, that's a neat trick.  So, because you apologized for it, that means you didn't insult him with no reason.  It erases it.  BULLSHIT.  Even if you did apologize for it, you are still a hypocrite, because you still do it, and it's not a single incident.  I can pull more examples if you or anyone needs.

Now, where exactly do I say that I relish in being an asshole?  Please show me this.  I've openly admitted to being an ass many a time and even to being an asshole on occasion.  I don't lie about that, not even to myself.  But you can tell me that it's a fact that I'm a dumbass, but completely subjective that you are a dumbass.  My, what high regard you have for your own opinions, that they are facts.  

Also, do I need to pull out the posts of you admonishing me for insulting.  I can find a whole post that just talks about it by you.  

And while we are at it.  Who in the hell do you think you are to tell me what is acceptable?  Answer me that!  What gives you that right?  You have pointed out many times that I shouldn't be a judge of you and the quality of your posts, but what makes you think you are qualified to judge me and the quality of mine?  Give me an H.  Give me a Y.  Give me a P.  you know where this is going, don't you.

That had nothing to do with view.  Zait's was properly written with capitals, periods, and spaces between paragraphs.  And I did read abe's.  And I treated it exactly the same...I read all of it I could read (there was german and other oddities) and once again took the whole of it and didn't pick any detail out.  You say you've made an example to show that I'm wrong...but your example shows nothing at all

Ok, 30 seconds of back tracking and I find this quote by you Bondo:

Like I said, it was too difficult to read...and it isn't like it is my duty to reply to everything.  Sorry, but if something isn't typed in a accessable manner I'm not going to bother.

Now, where is that great intelligence you talked about Bondo.  Too hard to read.  Bah, I read it without any problems at all.  And the post of Abe's that this was in response to had NO german in it.  You sure changed your tune from not bothering to giving it attention.  LOL.  This is like going through the Clinton testimony.  "I didn't think having sexual relations included oral sex".

Oh, and you've posted more then once for me to give Zaitsev a break because of his being young and trying, that I should overlook his gramar and writing.  How isn't that a double standard?  I mean, hit Zaitsev's profile and look at some of his sentences.  They ramble on so that I can't follow some of them.  He actually switches topic in mid sentences a few times.  Yet that's better then just not using the shift key?  BULLSHIT.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

I complain about your insults because they are specific and repetitive and directed at me.  If Bander or anyone else insulted me constantly I'm sure I would complain.

Your insults are specific, repetitive and directed at me.  So for you to always be complaining about them still points out what a hypocrite you are.  

You also illustrate just how this is a problem you have with me personally, and that you still have a dual standard.  You've jumped in when I've insulted Zaitsev and Bander, calling me out, but you've never jumped on them for insulting in the first place (afterall, Bander did come in with the first insults).     You'll jump in when I'm involved, even when I'm not talking to or about you.  But not when these guys do.  Nice double standard.

This is why I target you the most.  Because of my personal contempt for the hypocrite.  They are found everywhere, but on these forums, you are by far their king, ok, queen.  

There, I touched all the points you made.

Not quite, but a much better job of it.  Now you just need to actually refute them with some arguments that aren't so weak.  Seriously, look how I go about proving that your grades don't keep you from being a dumbass, using your own argument against you.  That's a good example.  Look how I went through Zaitsev's post and showed how it wasn't just a little number mistake (like you accuesed me of) but showed all the HUGE GAPING HOLES in it.  I mean, you can agree with his opinion all you want, but his argument and letter to the editor was absolute shit.  You couldn't refute anything I said about it, but you still say it was wonderful.  You then tell me to lower my standards because it was not an academic piece (even though it was for homework or some such stuff).  

You say I prove nothing, but you can't prove my facts wrong when I tear into someone's post.  So you attack my style because you are at the brunt end of it often.  Those are pretty weak positions Bondo, and that's why you can't defend them.  That and because you do half what you accuse me of, which makes you look like a complete hypocrite and dumbass.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Oh, one more point for Typhy that slipped my mind earlier, but is very important to the AK discussion.

When ex AK members come to me and tell me that Rapid has been asking them to hack my server and bring it down, why in the hell should I accomidate an AK members?

As for why I would believe them, because they've never lied to me.  Rapid has.  They also have (as far as I know) no reason to lie to me or to suck up to me in any way.  No motivation to lie.  

One last thing.  I didn't mention 9mm as the Tk'er.  Rapid TK'd in games as himself.  As to why he'd TK you, well, he did suck that much, he could have even TK'd you on accident.  Not that it matters at all.

[The Ghost of Bondo]

Well, I think it is hard for me to refute points...because that isn't objective.  It isn't like up to this point it isn't refuting and then there is suddenly a point when I have refuted them.

But this thread is getting a bit winded.  Here's my proposal Bucc.  I try my hardest (like I'm doing in the N. Korea/Iran thread) to be very consice with my points and have them be strong.  And you try to not feel the need to include ridicule in your questioning of points.  Think of it as an oppertunity to help educate rather than mock when someone gets something wrong (and I'm talking factually here not in opinion).  Anyway, I'm locking this thread...you can show agreement to proposal by going with it.

Apparently my ability to lock my own threads is gone...so I'll just ask that a moderator do it at some point.  Was going to add that this is my attempt to break the cycle as you put it...lets see if you are right and it is indeed in my power.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

I try my hardest (like I'm doing in the N. Korea/Iran thread) to be very consice with my points and have them be strong.  And you try to not feel the need to include ridicule in your questioning of points.  

Bondo, I've never ridiculed you on the occasions that you've made good solid posts.  You even pointed it out before.  

Just like with your post about peacekeeprs, I didn't ridicule that at all, but said it was a good idea (it just took you two pages later to notice that.)

I don't ridicule to ridicule.  Making fun of everything is Jeb's hobby (and the basis of his clan).  I only ridicule what I find to be moronic, unsupported opinions and flagerant mistakes that are used to prove something.  And it doesn't matter who the poster was.  And yes, I am the judge of what I think are moronic, unsupported opinions and flaggerant mistakes (but a good example would be something like the English coming to our aid in the French Indian Wars, and that being a basis of an argument.  I will mock the hell out of that kind of crap)  (and yes, I know you didn't say that, I used an example that wasn't you on purpose).

[The Ghost of Bondo]

but a good example would be something like the English coming to our aid in the French Indian Wars, and that being a basis of an argument.  I will mock the hell out of that kind of crap)  (and yes, I know you didn't say that, I used an example that wasn't you on purpose).

Hehe, I had a good laugh about that one...I'll agree Zait has much to learn...but perhaps you can help him with that rather than discourage him?

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Hehe, I had a good laugh about that one...I'll agree Zait has much to learn...but perhaps you can help him with that rather than discourage him?

I've tried, he hasn't bothered to pay attention (he asked the same question and got it answered three times in one thread) and has been insulting in the past as well.  So I see no reason to coodle (sp?) him.  He wants to act like a worldly man, I have no problem treating him like one.  And a worldly man that makes those consistantly stupid mistakes and ignores them would get (and rightfully so) as much mocking as I could muster.

Wordly women count too.  I don't discriminate.  Dumbasses have no age, gender, race, nationality or god in my opinion, they can be anywhere.  And aren't too hard to find.

[Typhy]

Ok, I'll just go straight down the list, like Bondo:

You don't like me because I use facts in my arguments. Hilarious, fucking hilarious. I'm truly at a loss for words on this one.

An interesting mix between dodging what I said, and changing it around. Another way to look at it would be a mix between Infection and Silent Killer. . . Anyway, I can tell that this will become a "yes" - "no" - "yes" - "no" argument, so I will leave it where it is and not continue if further.

Typhy, I banned you and the rest of AK because, guess what, that's what is better for everyone as a whole. Sure it makes it suck for you people in AK, but it makes the games more enjoyable for everyone else because we don't have to deal with the inevitable bullshit and strife that accompanies AK. The only other people I ban are TK'ers because *shock* they make it suck for everyone else playing too. BTW, anyone who leaves AK will be unbanned from my server; just ask iRunx.

Well I disagree with how argument, I'm glad that you actually took the time to respond to an argument that you are weak on. I'd like to start out by simply saying that I hate people who base their opinions of people based on what clan tag they have in front of their name. - I give Lothario the same respect that I did when he was in KoS, and Cringe the same as when he would give me IPs on AIM. The (unt clan has constantly disrespected me and my clan, do I take that out on any new member? No. So, Ace, tell me this; ( Mauti, I'll use you as an example, since we all love you ) if tomorrow *DAMN Mauti were to join AK and become |?K| Mauti, would he be ban from your server? I expect an answer to that question.

Way to not get it Typhy.? I don't have you banned at all and you damn well know it.? Deadeye banned you in the past, and I lifted it, as you damn well know.? So anything that starts with me having you banned is bullshit.?

Bucc, I don't believe I was talking to you, and if I was, I'm sorry, it was a mistake on my part. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't have a big problem with you. Sure I consider you a bit of an asshole for the way that you've treated my friends, but only so much can be based on how you treat them, much of it has to be based off of how you treat me, which in general has been pretty good.

You have the right to protest it and start a boycott of Ace's server.? But he's still not wrong.? You chose to make yourself part of that group, it's not like he has banned ex-AK's.

Very poor examples in my opinion, so I'll play along with a few of my own: I used to be a Bulls fan, back when they were good, with Pippen, Jordan, Kerr, etc. I hated the Spurs; as the Bulls team was breaking up, Kerr was signed by the Spurs, however, he remained one of my favorite players. It didn't matter that he was a Spur, sure I'd go against his team, but I always liked to see him do well, and I never started to hate him just because of what team he's on.

[/color]

[Typhy]

I'd like to ask Ace to give me a list of any AK that he's had problems with, the only ones who I can think of that will be on that list are Rapid and myself. Currently AK is a clan with 16 members, should you base your opinions of 7/8ths of a clan on the actions of 1/8th? You got a problem with me? Ok, I think you're an asshole for putting me on block because we've disagreed on the forums, but at least you have a reason, weak as it is, a reason is a reason; however, you're saying that you block my whole clan? What's up with that? Even your ex SEAL, Vapor? Even Ex SWAT, MPE?

Doesn't matter, and you missed the point.? The point is boycotting is a nice, peaceful way to demonstrate our disapproval.? It's not my fault, nor my concern that some people fall for childish insults and taunts that they are too afraid and using it as an excuse.? It's not an excuse.? I've only seen Rapid and Monk play GhR, and I wasn't impressed.? Rapid got his ass handed to him worse then Spaz.? So, I'm not afraid.? Maybe I just don't like him, or what I fell is the typical AK bullshit, and don't want to deal with it.? Gosh, maybe it's just that simple.

I've never seen anyone in my clan play GHR, why not? Because I hate GHR. Your talking about my team being bad at GHR is like me talking about how big I can own you all at MOH or RTCW ( You could consider yourselves lucky if you could get 1 kill of me in a 20 minute game at either of those ). Why doesn't that mean anything to you? Oh yeah, because those aren't the games that you play!

So, like I said Typhy.? You don't have to agree with our reasons.? But I'm not a little kid that can be brought down by a little taunting either.? I have no respect for AK as a clan, and I have plenty of reasons, which we could talk about for a long time.? Since I have little to no respect for the clan, why should I play or CB with them?? Why should Ace let them on his server?

Do me a favor and read exactly what you wrote, several times if needed, until you see just how dumb it sounds. - When I host Rogue Spear, should I let only the people who I respect into my games? Hmm, that'd be probably 2 people; *DAMN Mauti and +-KoS-+ Ultimo. Is this whole thing about respect? I respect the people who have achieved more in this community than I have, I suppose you could probably throw Bondo into there too, since he's one of the people who helped to found the battle league. So, should I block everyone but buddies, then reduce my buddy list to 3 people? Biggest game I'd ever get is 3 people, since Bondo doesn't play Rogue Spear.  

 [/color]

[Mr. Lothario]

So I see no reason to coodle (sp?) him.

     Hehe. With all the words you can't spell, you question the spelling of that one? It's "coddle," by the way.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Loth, I think it's the first time I've ever used that word, and I had honestly no idea how to spell it.  Especially with the friday night buzz going.

I've never seen anyone in my clan play GHR, why not? Because I hate GHR. Your talking about my team being bad at GHR is like me talking about how big I can own you all at MOH or RTCW ( You could consider yourselves lucky if you could get 1 kill of me in a 20 minute game at either of those ). Why doesn't that mean anything to you? Oh yeah, because those aren't the games that you play!

Take your time and go back over it Typhy.  You were the one implying that Boycotting is an excuse to not play you guys.  I was pointing out that it has nothing to do with fear, since I'm not afraid, and that little taunts like that don't work on me (and I've seen those taunts in the Bar and Grill, by you and Rapid and other AK's.

So, what I'm saying is, it's not fear, it's that I don't like the clan.

Do me a favor and read exactly what you wrote, several times if needed, until you see just how dumb it sounds. -

Read and read.  Doesn't sound stupid at all.  Now you try it.

When I host Rogue Spear, should I let only the people who I respect into my games? Hmm, that'd be probably 2 people; *DAMN Mauti and +-KoS-+ Ultimo. Is this whole thing about respect? I respect the people who have achieved more in this community than I have, I suppose you could probably throw Bondo into there too, since he's one of the people who helped to found the battle league. So, should I block everyone but buddies, then reduce my buddy list to 3 people? Biggest game I'd ever get is 3 people, since Bondo doesn't play Rogue Spear.  

Well, that sucks to be you then Typhy.  Sorry to hear it.

But you don't have it quite right either.  I don't care who you want to play with or don't want to.  That's your business.  But why should you, or anyone else, tell us who we should play with?

Why should you, or anyone else, be able to make us play with people we don't respect, and don't  want to associate with?  I don't care if you want to play with people you don't like, but why should that apply to anyone else?

Another quick note: I notice you don't respect Rapid either.  There is still hope for you.

As for your sporting team analogy, it doesn't fit at all.  You belong, are a member of by choice, a group that believes and behaves in ways I don't agree with.  When I see the way your group acts (the few times I've seen them challenging people to CB or in games), I am repulsed by them.  So, if, say, Deadeye were to join the KKK, would I still be his friend?  No.  No matter how long we've known each other and been friends, his membership in that group would make me feel that I shouldn't associate with him socially.  Not only would I expect people to start assuming I was just as much of an asshole biggot, but I would be accepting him being an asshole biggot, which I would not.  

What part of that don't you get?  I don't blindly follow anything or anybody.  I would lay down my life for my friends if needed, but if they were assholes that I didn't agree with, I would chose to end the friendship.

And yep, if Mauti joined AK, I would expect to see him on the ban list right after.  

You may hate that there's a label on you because of your clan, but you are the one that put the label there.  You put those letters on your name.  So either you stand behind them, change them, or leave them.  But you still have the tag, and AK doesn't seem to have changed.  So you must then agree with them (at least more than not).

One last thing.  You talk about Ace ducking it.  But how about that little case of Rapid asking AK's to hack the MacClans server.  I noticed you ducking that one too.

[Ace]

First, to answer the Typhy's question, yes I would ban Mauti as soon as I saw him with the AK clan tag on.

I don't know how many times I have to tell you Typhy, I think your clan is a plague and a menace to the GhR/RS/R6 community. I'm doing what I can to get rid of that plague. This also includes not CB'ing you guys. Yes, the only ones I've had big problems with are you and Rapid, but so what? You guys are the leaders of AK and set the tone for the clan. Anyone who joins AK is buying into your bullshit, and therefore suck by association.

If you want to host your server and only let people you respect join, that's fine. (Interesting to note that you don't respect Rapid.) On the other hand, I let everyone play on my server except for those that A) I feel do harm to the community and B) I truly hate. AK and all the TK'ing assholes who have bans are in group A. So far Bander is the only one in group B, and unless Bondo starts playing GhR I don't think that group B will grow.

If you want to go by your sports analogy, I got a perfect example. Anyone who plays for the Dodgers can suck it long and suck it hard. For example, I respected Charles Johnson as a great defensive catcher when he was with Florida. When he got traded to the Dodgers, to steal a line from Deadeye, I wouldn't let him lick the sweat off my balls if he were dying of thirst. If you join an association that is truly evil and wrong, like the Dodgers or AK, then you lose out because of guilt by association.

[The Ghost of Bondo]

For example, I respected Charles Johnson as a great defensive catcher when he was with Florida. When he got traded to the Dodgers...

Uhh, the Rockies have Charles Johnson...they got him in the Mike Hampton trade...or did I miss something.  I don't follow baseball that closely due to it sucking.

[Mr. Lothario]

     Totally off-topic here, and I apologize, but is this thread displaying weirdly for anyone else? Starting on reply #46 and continuing to the latest, all the posts are smooshed to one side or the other, in small columns. This is the only thread affected, and I've never seen that before on this forum. I'm perplexed and annoyed.