*DAMN R6 Forum

   As a few of you may know, electronicjo and I have recently developed a server that reflects the protocol of which GameRanger uses. The cause of this recent development was due to the recent "blocks" which have been inflicted against non-premium GameRanger users. Some of the more notable ones are the NetFone block, and prevention of fast-user switching. Our server was simply a response to the oppressive nature of which GameRanger has seem to become.

   We have realized that this server, no matter how good the intentions, is not the right step to take. In light of this, we have deicded to develop a completely NON-CONTROVERSIAL server/client framework. This will be in no way associated with GameRanger, completely seperate. Our goals for this new game-matching service are to provide gamers with a free platform of which to communicate and play with other gamers. Currently there is no website, as development is currently in early stages. Some of it's core features we plan to implement are: Chat, Buddies, Game-Matching, Game Server lists, and more.

   At this time, we are seeking any skilled programmers that have experience with Objective-C, or Carbon. This service will truly be for gamers, and please, show your support for us and drop us an email, as it only makes us want to progress even farther. Look around in the next week as I will post again on our current progress.

Again, feel free to reply to this post with any suggestions, comments, or questions you might have.


You can contact me at:

Email: xoclipse@cox.net
AIM Screenname - xoclipse

xoclipse

Moderators: Please do not delete this post, as it encourages nothing illegal, it is simply informative, and open to discussion and suggestions.

good wish u best luck

http://www.hulla-balloo.com/openletter/

Yes, I think we've all seen that link. I don't think I was around when that happened though, or I just don't remember it vividly enough.

GS is a shining example of a GR clone that went to hell, oh I loved that stuff. You guys need to get lives if you intend to make another GR clone just because Evill is some evil dictator in your minds.

A bit of competition in the mac gaming community will be good.
In order to get the best results in products and customer service
you need  alternatives .
I can only salute that.  ;)

Sadly, this market isn't big enough.

But it is growing.  I know that you cannot compare it pc market.
If ppl don't try making alternatives the market has no room to grow.
For the moment the mac community has no need for hundreds of
online game servers, but there is room for one or 2 more.
We only have one option now. (that I know of)

I think they're planning for it to be both windows and mac. This way they don't really have to worry that the mac-only market is "too small". I can't speak for the developers but I would guess they'd make as many games as possible cross-compatible, and have some rooms be PC-only, some mixed, and some Mac-only, whichever you choose. Again just guessing, they would probably include features such as optional Encrypted P2P communication for Private Messages and Private Chatrooms. They would also have the ability to leave messages for offline users, similar to ICQ, more customizable info boxes, highly-moderated rooms and sparsely-moderated rooms, notification that your buddy is typing in private messages, ability to anonymously report abusive users, video conferencing, and allow P2P file transfer (though not like Kazaa/Napster). I would guess that they would allow third-party client applications to connect to their server and would release enough information for users to build their own clients.

I think they would ban you from that place too, Ross.

Dream on buster, dream on.

If it is completely legitimate and mac only, it will be a good thing.  

While I agree with Kami that the market isn't big enough to sustain two Mac gaming services, if it's real competition it will only help make the survivor a better service.

There are a few "if's" in there though.  They have lots of work cut out for them.  Plenty of challenges.

And if it's Windoze too, it will blow.  Who needs that?  Popular games that are cross platform seem to have built in services to join games.  And does anyone need just another chat client to talk to their windows buddies?  You can use IRC, ICQ, AIM or just a simple KDX to do that.

I'm not sure why everyone compares GameRanger to other stuff.  Have you guys not been out there at all?  Some of you act as if GameRanger is the only product of it's kind in the world.

As to Mr. Xoclipse.  If you are going to spend the time/money/will power/talent on an endeavor such as creating a new "GR" clone, why limit yourself to what GR has done?  GR offers very little in the greater scope of things.  If you are going to create competition with GR, then don't just change the icon and call it something new and slap a sticker on it with a worthless guarantee.  It seems that you are merely trying to improve upon what GR has at this moment.  If that's the case, stop.  You're wasting your time.  Be creative and come out with someone completely different.  If you want competition, you are going to have do something different, not improved.

As simple as something like Battle Net is, it offers a few interesting things, such as: keeps track of your stats (wins/losses), let's you select the region you are closer to, etc.

With the amount of resources you are going to put into a project such as yours, I would hope you are not limiting yourself because of predisposed ideas of how to make GR better.

.::|N| Noto

I know what you are saying Noto, and by no means, do we plan to "limit" our project to what GameRanger is. We have no set, iron-clad goals right now. We are right now mapping out the basic framework, such as user management and chat. We plan on including many things, such as game-matching, buddy management, user -> user file sharing, and probably a lot more integration with OS X. The possibilites are endless, if you think about it. As a programmer, you make the choices at what you want, and the sky is the limit. If it can be done, we should be able to achieve it. If we mantain the community's support, focus, and don't lose track of the big picture, our endeavor will succeed.

xoclipse

Xo i really suggest that you guys make it as good as it can be and dont release it for a bit. Evill will most likely be planning to make GR pay only in a bit due to the lack of funding. When he does this i think you guys should release ur service so all of us cheap asses can hop over there (which is about 850+ people on GR without premium) and continue to game with macs only. I think its a great idea and if you need any kind of help with development ill be glad to use my webdesigning/photoshopping skills to help you guys out.

i do obj-c... how much are you guys willing to pay though  ;D

You're going to be wasting a lot of time on a fruitless project.

kami, I never get tired of your optimism, or lack thereof. :D

Kami why do you think its a waste of time? As far as i can see, and from the information xoclipse has made available how can it be anything but the potential for a good thing or better? Good luck to you xoclipse

As long as theirs no retarted admins, im in! ::)

you're a simpleton, mainman.

Possibly the most interesting thing would be to provide win/loss tracking support and built-in ladder capabilities for all games supported by this system. I have a bit of obj-c programming behind me - are you going to host this on sourceforge and make it open-source? The OS developer community for mac has grown by leaps and bounds with the introduction of X, and do you plan on taking advantage of this - additionally there is a slew of excellent libraries already available in the open source community.

Another idea - what if you operated this system much like a P2P distributed system rather than a central server run system - bandwith costs money, and depending on the number of users connecting to a central server you can run up serious bandwith costs with no business model (adverts, i doubt would be able to support it). This is why Kevill has to offer premium services - we live in a business world like it or not. A P2P system (the file sharing networks are a good example) has no central database, instead people would advertise games to others close, and a distributed query approach would then advertise these games out. Bookmarks could be made for dedicated servers, etc - and a SDK could be created for client implementation.

This could benefit the BL greatly, as scores could be submitted directly by a BL-specific client. There is a lot of opportunity here, and I for one think an open-source alternative is the way to go.

I would be more than happy to assist in development of this - drop me an email ntw3 AT cwru DOT edu.


For a simple description of how the P2P networks work, here's a link
http://computer.howstuffworks.com/file-sharing.htm (http://computer.howstuffworks.com/file-sharing.htm)

I say it's wasted time because from the looks of it, these guys are going to spend a lot of time trying to program this thing, and in the end I don't think they can expect to get a big audience and I don't think they can expect to get as good game support as they may wish, and thus it will all become a big failure, and I will laugh. Damn that's a long sentence.

They will succeed cause they will have support of most of comunity and u guys that think they wont are loosers, they have a conviction!! I go with u guys, i agree about finding a good way like p2p system so the cost could close to Zero.

And maybe if u want to get more people just open it to PC users 2.

Any way i cant help cause i'm stupid and dont know shit about programming, but like i paid for premium to support evill initiative (see i'm stupid), now I can tell u i'lll pay for ur systeme (no more than 10box/year) if it can be like or better than GR.

GO guys go i can tell u most of comunity is with u!!! and KAMI will play alone some tictactoe on GR next year!!!

I am not behind this idea, i also agree with kami, it has taken evill 5 yrs off his hard work (ok i have only been here for one) to get GR to where it is, through all the problems and the fixes, the updates. He might be a pain in the arse, but so are we to him (well i am :D).

Ghost do you speak for most of the comunity? where are their posts.

I would hate a cross platform gaming thing, its bad enough as it is now between the 'vets' and the 'noobs'. If you add PC players can u imagine the arguments. It would turn into a geek fest.

keep things as they are. if it aint broken dont fix it.

and there is nothing wrong with tic tac toe
 ;)

Ghost, you just say that because you're French.

Kami please don't turn this into another french bashing, keep on topic.
This has absolutely nothing to do with this.
Maybe it was a joke, but alot of topics have turned sours after these kinds of threads.
Getting on topic again.
I do not see the harm in ppl trying to make an alternative for GR.
GR turned into a business and good business needs competition.
As a GR premium member you will benefit from this as well, because better
updates with cooler features will come at a faster pace.
I say live and let live

Having Premium does make things a bit more bearable on GR.  It has some nice features, and for $4.17 USD per month, that's not a bad deal.  It's even cheaper for the Euros.

Don't forget Euro kids out there, the exchange rate against the US Dollar is in your favor!

$50.00 USD = ?41,67 = ?41.67(roughly)

That would come out to around ?3,47/?3.47 per month.

I know that there are some not so good features about GR (NF block, KDX block, Multiple users block, anti-modification plug-in, etc.), but until something better comes out, I'll stick to GR.

.::|N| Noto

I see where everything comes into play.  As a suggestion to the chat interface. Until its fully up and running, try contacting AOL's IM services. (Yes I know it sucks, but it could take away the bandwidth).  Its a thought.  Another thing is to get the game server lists and shit like that up first.  We can hang out on GR, and play on the new program.  I can make the website XO, just email me, and I can get a logical diagram up for you and your buddies to see.  Good luck.

Blitz 8)

If you do deside to keep track of peoples scores ingames, maybe you should let the host deside if they want ot host a game that dos, eg: in the hosting settings- Ladder game [?] or Ladder game

its entirely possible to keep track of a player's score in game (kill totals, deaths ect). Its all listed in the stats.html file, which can me checked, and recorded easily. Ace and i began work on a tool to do that as well as control all the hidden features in the options.xml file as well as a dedicated server admin tool for map rotations and game types. But we lost interest and never finished it.
Perhaps we will do something along those lines for raven shield once we figure out what can be done with the game's engine.