*DAMN R6 Forum

Just want to see what peeps opinions are on the war zone mod. I for one dont like the idea, but i also want to get a poll to see what the rest of the guys think!

I mean the times i have played it, it sems like one team gets the war zone and camps it out and the other team runs out of time looking for the campers!! if they go to the war zone to get it back so they dont run out of time they r shot. I think it makes camping worse!!!

WZ is cool and fun, but i still choose LMS for the ladder.

lol

wtf is this...

where's "hell no!"  ;D

i do like playing warzone. it is a fun alternative to lms, if it is instituted i think; if warzone is instituted here is what i would do...score a point for the team that has the most guys left as well as a point for winning the warzone.. so if team A has more guys left and wins the time in warzone, they get two points. if team A wins warzone but team B has more guys left, its a split 1-1. the first team that gets to 10 wins overall. win by 2...lol..just a thought.

yeah.. i miss the "hell no!" button in this voting too... i don?t like this mod and won?t like to play it in cbs... i would if it will be chosen, but not with much fun...

[one] Civic

-out-

After seeing all the discussions earlier about this matter, My opinion with introducing a new mod for the ladder would stand at allowing it to be optional rather than be permanant.  GHR ladders on the PC side allow cb's to take place with options such as different game types.  I think this would serve most fit four our Ladder.  

Um... I voted for its fun... But i dont even think its fun i vote NO.

thnx,

 ;D

Well I have played warzone several times and I have found people including myself, camping, Warzone camping. I get the warzone and have to stay close to hold it. Not very fun and intense as LMS in my opinion. I have also found a lot more lag in the games as well. Seeing how hard it was to get games going in finals due to lag, this seems to be a potential problem. This is a cool style of game play but I think LMS should stay for the Battle Leagues main competition.

After intensive testing of the Campzone--no I mean Warzone mod I still prefer LMS, especially for DAMN Battle League CBS!

LONG LIVE LMS!!!  The pure GhR experience!! ::)

I voted optonal, but there is this catch that some clans will only play warzone, and some only LMS, so this could infact just be a break in the community, so maybe it would be better to have one or the other.

I think lms should stay. Well think about it this way. If one team gets the warzone, that team will camp with the warzone base in sight, because if the other team does not get it back within 3 minutes the game is over. I can see how it might prevent a little camping, but for the team defending the warzone, the camping just gets worse.

OMG, this thread kills me, have you guys even tryed to come up with some WZ tactics?  Didnt think so.

For one thing, if you tag the wz, the enemie knows where you are...doh, and can easly move on you EVEN ON THE STRONGHOLD FROM SPAWN 4!!!  and as far as campable bases, lets go over that.  How many bases can you stay around and camp in?  Arnt we all bitching about Emb and stronghold...kinda stupid.

I for one like the idea of WZ being a BL ladder, be if one or both WZ and LMS.  I would like to add that i personaly think LMS is the main reason for all the camp bitching. Think about it guys, how many clans do we know that dont leave their spawn point at all (wz would kill that).  How many clans do we know that go for the first kill, then camp (wz would kill that).  

I think you all need to be a lil more open minded and really give this a try befor you get all scared and trash the idea.

Yeah, harvey put up a poll, but it had a bunch of crappy options, no offense harv, but I don't even like warzone at all and there was no option for that, the worst option there was stated that you liked it.

Right on.

i said undecided becuase it would be a good idea for the league (a sub-ladder to LMS) if they fixed the bugs out, and added a timer, in its current condition, hell no.

i personally think that every mod would be a bad idea for the BL... and then lms is definitely the best choice! we should keep it how it is... kill the ideas of changing to a mod, most people want to stay at lms!

I think we should all move to Fridges thread.

Doc, you can have one guy sacrifice himself to get the base and 1 guy camp on a highland in ghost town for example guarding the base.....camping

Sar that actually sounds like a cool strategy.  See nothing wrong with it.  thats a different kind of camping.

Actually it is the first good example of a sniper being useful in a cb

Flies:  I see yur point and unfortunately I dont see these bugs getting fixed before the next season.  Maybe WZ should wait for that reason (enthusiasm disappearing)

IF... warzone were to be implemented It seems it would have to be an optional ladder.

As for everyone else, the short sightedness of your views is very sad.

I am begining to realize that not many clans are capable of the organizing, strategizing, or have the balls to make an interesting BL.  WAKE UP!   <----------- very frustrated

 

THIS IS FREE, from c| to you

the best strategy to win an LMS cb is this:

set-up a sensor perameter not too far from your original spawn point.  The more sensor coverage the better (you will need this when yur chump ass opponent realizes they have to come after you in order to have any chance of winning, and your team will be well protected behind sensors)  

Are your sensors placed?  Great!  Now you're only half way to victory.  Now with a couple preplanned sniping positions around this perameter all you have to do is wait for your sucker opponents to take a peak around that corner.  Be ready cause you only need ONE kill.  Hey Look!  there he is....  Go ahead champ.  Shoot em.  POW!  Great Shot.  Now run for cover!

Woohoo!!  you did it!  they only have three guys left against your four and now THEY have to come after you or else they lose.  Its a good thing you have a lot of protected coverage here around yur spawn point.   All you have to do is knock them off one by one as they come over that hill.  

"But what if they have a coordinated multi-pronged assualt?" you ask.

Dont be silly.  No one is that organized.  Hey your sensors have picked up all three enemies, and here comes one now.  BAM!   two down.

Here comes another...  OMG holy shit!  FRAG coming yur way!  BAboom! k... so yur dead no worries.  you're still ahead by one guy.  (next time remember to change yur camping position after each of your kills).  

But we're still in good shape because they don't have a clue where your other three teammates are.  And now they seemed to have stalled not sure what to do.  Too bad cause times about to run out.  

10 secs. left and they do a kamikazi.  No problem though.  Boom bang they're gone.  You win. GJ.  It took ten minutes, but heck, a win is a win.  


"So now what if the other team catches on and does the same exact sensor camp tactic?" you ask.

Well then I advise you get comfy cause it's going to be a LONG night.


You want to know how to win the whole LMS Battle League?  it's simple...

don't lose catch my drift?


s-s-i-c-k b-o-y

 


 

Wow, so if I state my opinion about the mod, i get called a closed minded person with no capabilities for creating team strategies. Hum, well all I can say is this is a mod and I dont think it should replace LMS cb's. Did I say I wouldn't play it and dominate at it? No I did not, I just gave the reasons I dont want to see it replace LMS. I think it would be a great 2nd Ladder, but remember it is a mod that has some glitches. As far as the tactics are concerned, maybe you should work up some tactics for dealing with campers, BTs did and they worked last season. I dont care how you play the game, I may get mad cause you camped me out, but I will find a way around the problem. So I would ask the people that want to see warzone replace LMS, please take a step back and look carefully at other peoples opinions, dont forget, you want them to look at yours. I for one have been playing warzone, with great success mind you, and that is were I have drawn my conclusion. If warzone becomes the standard, then BTs will dominate  ;D no question about it.  

Fus I dont think yur close minded.  
 
Apologies for the close minded remark.  But I believe there is a heavy weight of opinions that are not very well tested or thought out.

this has been since the first post.  

Well lets see it then fusion/BTs. All i read out of you guys is that you love last man camping and hate WZ.  And you always seem to get those bad spawns.  eight tryed to show us that spwn 4 on stronghold owns, and what did we show you, same storey for the bank spawn on EMB.  You guys bitched last season about the camping "this clan camps, that clan camps" you have to know that lms lets a clan camp and win (after that first kill).  I just think you guys shouldnt be to scared of something new, and maybe a lil more fun/faster...

Try these...

The faults I see in WZ:

#1. The games tend to move at a faster pace.  I have mixed feelings about this.  In one sense it's great, you have to really be thinking and moving quick.  This is a great test of skill.  But then again I did like how LMS has a longer build up of tension that leads to greater excitement or even disappointment in the end. In LMS each bullet is precious, every corner is a ledge, every step is carefully taken.  Fear creeps in.  In WZ things can sometimes move so fast it's hard to keep track of all the thoughts going through my head.  Sometimes its a massacre, clashing the center, 3 mins to find a solution, a way in, a clear shot, something.  (actually, 3 mins. is a lot of time considering you have a good idea of where the enemy is.)

#2. Depending upon the strategy you choose to take as a team, you might see less gun battles happening at the edges of the maps.  In WZ most gun battles happen near the center of the map.  In one sense I think that it's great.  But I do like some of those unique match ups that take place in those rarely visited corners or alleys.  it's sometimes like maps within maps.   Actually, now that I think about it again.  It was usually within Siege games that this ever occured, not LMS.      

#3. Some disadvantaged spawns.  Whats the disadvantage? Harder to get to the WZ?  It is slightly further away for some.  There are ways around this though.  This is where organized strategies come into play.  (Thats all I can say without giving away tactics.)  These spawn points are still at a disadvantage in LMS, unless your plan to camp it.  And If it's still a problem we should try to re-position the WZ base.

#4.  I think the random insert bug, like Flies had mentioned, is potentionally a big problem.  I haven't noticed this yet and would like to look into it more. Correct colors would be nice, and maybe a timer too.      

But overall, I still think the advantages to WZ (as explained in numerous posts) still outweigh LMS.

I would like to play the Warzone mod, if fixed, on the BattleLeague.

But whatever gamestyle next season will be (LMS or WZ), I think we should ban sensors.
WHAT!? BAN SENSORS? ARE YOU NUTS!?
Nope, it's the only way to really get rid of the camping.

You can't camp without sensors, or as BTs Eight would say: You can't play chess without sensors.
If you try to camp without them, you get flanked or shot before you spot them.

Banning sensors will help LMS definately, but it also works for Warzone.
People against WZ say: the team who spawns closest to the base will go there, camp and win.
I will say: try camping at the base in the middle of a map surrounded by the other team without sensors! No chance at all.

Banning sensors will attract more people to play Warzone and hey, even LMS can be fun again!

Greetings,
Dutchman / ViRuS

For some reason, the idea of banning sensors doesnt sound half as bad.  If im not mistaken, there was a PC ladder that had a ban on sensors.  Players on the ladder stated that it was more tatically inclined with less problems camping.  

Maybe the easy way out of changing an entire gametype is to take the "baby steps" necessary to reach a BL with less complaining.  ;D

Although being a sensor lover, i would not be against banning them. it would probably add sharpness and precision to the LMS game.
 i never saw any reason to add speed to the ghr game, but i clearly see the point of camping. but as many people have discussed - Clans will find a way to camp anyway, LMS or it be WZ.

if it helps against camping - banning sensors is just fine by me

[one]Rampage
 

Wow doc.. I see your trying to make friends. Ssick, no harm done, I just want it to be known that some people that disagree with warzone have looked at the mod and played it and some (inluding me) has played it very successfully. Dutch... I have won the warzone games several times by getting to the zone first and camping it out, so you cant tell me that doesnt work. I have proven it several times that it does.

As for sensors, I remember when people didnt play with sensors, All I used is grenades. I have found sensors to be very helpful for me now when I use my grenades. I like sensors, but would I cry if they are banned, no I wouldnt. I think you guys are missing some of the issues.

Some people are sooo bend on using the "warzone mod" they dont really care what others say. I will give you some advice, if you want me to see "your" opinion to be valid then you should be nice about it and give some nice invites to pleasant conversation. If you are not going to treat people with respect then  why should they listen to you?

Mauti, I would like to see what your thoughts are on this issue. I know your role is for the Betterment of the *DAMN Battle League, as it should be. I am looking forward to some good ole battles with you this season. Please give us your ideas on this issue.

I know you are good at camping Fusion ;)
My point is that camping WITH sensors is much easier, and more likely to happen, than camping without sensors.

Ban sensors (LMS and WZ) and camping won't be that productive as it is now.

Ouch... Thanks sexy...  ;D

I understand your point and if you read my post, you will see that im not opposed to no sensors, a 1v1 league I know about does not allow sensors. I have no problem with the lack of sensors. I am just saying if used, not abused, they are good to have. But you know how that goes. Besides if there are no sensors, I will be forced to use a sniper and shoot you at long ranges.  ::)

But even if you didnt "sensor camp" the warzone.. U would still be forced to camp it to keep control of it. And sometimes it is hard to get back out of a   warzone if you are the first to get there... You just have to get to a good little nook and camp it out and pick off people as they try to get the the warzone.

I recall mentioning the banning of sensors in a thread about this topic quite some time ago... I thought it would be rejected more vigorously than anything else, so I didn't press the issue.  Looks like I underestimate how reasonable some of you are.  Sorry for that.

In any case, I would be for no sensors.  I haven't ever really used them anyway.  I would however appreciate if most of you would read my thread, even if you do not post.  I tried to cover all bases, and if you give it some quiet thought without the immediate negative reaction that lesser humans respond with, I think you might agree.  Keep up the discussion guys, its the only way we get anywhere.

My thread is located here: http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~damnr6/yabbse/index.php?board=3;action=display;threadid=4707

We played many seasons with the old rules, not many people had complaints, so my opinion is to keep the ladder the way it is.

agreed, but i do think that no sensors would stop camping, but damn, no more sensors in training, that was the best when you had claymores or nades.

Ok... I'll be nice now.  But hell, some of you guys with your wild+wrong opinions were really pissing me off.  Take sar's latest for instance (sorry sar)

"We played many seasons with the old rules, not many people had complaints, so my opinion is to keep the ladder the way it is."

Are you kidding?  we only stopped complaining when we realized it wasn't getting anywhere.  And this push for change is one big complaint itself.  

Fusion you could do about anything you want and still win. Snipe, nade, frag, AND camp.  But you understand (i know you do) that camping a base in the center of the map is much harder than camping an edge of a map.  Plus I think you miss understand the purpose.  Even though its called WZ, it's still 9 times out of 10 about eliminating your opponent.  So it's your choice, try yur hand at camping the center (not easy) or spread the map tactically finishing off your foe.  It's makes for a lot more interesting game than Hide and go seek.    

Anyway... I give up.  No more posts on WZ for me.  Either you guys get it or you don't.                                                                

I understand where you are coming from Ssick, you are right that it would totally change tactics. There have been several occasions where I was the last guy left and I had to go from one side of a map to other and back again to eliminate the other 2 or 3 guys. You know, attack withdraw relocate attack withdraw, etc. This for the most part would be eliminated with warzone. There would be no time to do that. So "one" of the reasons I do not want to go to warzone is it eliminates a lot of gaming style thats effective, and im not talking about camping. Dont get me wrong guys, I will do whatever Mauti wants, but I am just merely giving my reasons to stick with LMS for main competition.

I do hope that someone steps up and fixes/rewrites the warzone mod. Call me anal but I dont like the glitches, and the extra lag it seems to bring concerns me also.

I truly hope we get an anwser soon, team tactics need to be worked on with whatever latter is chosen. You will see things different this season in BTs and some things the same(you know like us winning  ;D ) . BTs is a great team and we can/will adapt to most circumstances.

yeah crypt..it doesnt even say how much time your team has had the warzone conquered for! I agree, it is a little buggy.

Hey for the banning sensors thing... i found that sensors help pick out the camping teams...

Hey eight, I found out that if you ban sensors there are hardly any campers left!

so what 8 and Dutch are trying to say is, Attacking sensors can find the non sensor campers.

wow, let's just agree like this before the game:
"Ahhh, our teams going to camp, can we not have sensors"

or

"We plan on running right at your ass and shooting you while you hide, can we please activate sensors."

What  a moment of absolute clarity.

Ok, I emailed majorplaying who wrote the WZ mod an asked how easy it would be to move the WZ on certain maps where there is an obvoius advantage due to spawn points.

Can ppl post what maps should have the WZ moved and where they think it should be moved to.

I havent had an answer from him yet i only mailed him 5 mins ago but if he checks this thread (i linked him 2 it) perhaps some suggestions will be up.

Mb im a little premature posting this lready but, hey prematures good right? specially regarding eja......su coke....ok......nm

cokeleberry finn and fiends

how will sensors help find people who are camping...if their camping, they will not show up on sensors...

P.S. there is a thread open for this topic.

- lol Fahq
- nJ coke

we discovered awhile back that Majorplayer didn't care to change the bugs in his mod.  But maybe after he sees all the commotion over it, he might re-consider.

Short answer Doc. When they are camping in a place, like around a corner.. We light them up and I give them a nice little explosive package.

OK, first off besides the obvious fact I'm not the most....uhh.....enthusiastic GhR player of all you, when reading over all these weird-ass worded polls I saw there's 4 simple options...

whats this....the 3rd poll made about warzone

Yes the orginal may not have had the best choice as what comes to options, but it gets the job done. So i really dont see the point in this one  ???

A better alternative:

http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~damnr6/yabbse/index.php?board=3;action=display;threadid=4707

Please read this thread. Dont be scared of all the words, this is a good idea.

I've started ANOTHER(!!!) new topic.check it out
coke

I emailed majorplaying and got this reply........

Personally i dont mind what you do with Warzone or any of my other mods. The only thing that would bother me is if you changed them and called them yours. Ive been told that you cant use igor on a mac so moving the warzone would be impossible to do. It is quite easy to move the warzone however you would have to create a custom map and move the central area. The whole process would take maybe 3 minutes. If you gave me more input as to which maps and where you want the warzone i could easily make a few custom maps for you guys. Thanks for the compliments on my mods and playing them.

???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? MP

I think where he says u cant move the wz, he means u cant move the spawn points, but if ppl can think of better places for the wz to be then lets hear em and ill mail him back. I'll watch this topic, so lemme know kids.....

Coke

I vote we move the warzone to the grabage!

This is a personal oppinion, and does not reflect my fellow bts guys.

Well Coke.  To be honest it is not needed to use IGOR to change the warzone central area.  Although it is known that a new file for each map would need to be made to change the center spot for each map.  The simple fact is that Warzone is a one page script to run into the missions folder of the game.  Most people know that.  Problem is that if you chanbge the center spot then again, you have to change each map accordingly, ot at least the ones that have the bad spawn spot for the center smoke.  In that case it would make the file from being a simple 1 page script to a multi-meg file, and people just dont want to go to that much trouble to install a mod for cbing.  It will turn a 25kb file into a 7.5 meg file or so.  In either event it's not worth it just to add new center spots.  Just eliminate the maps that have the bad spots.

     As for moving the spawn points, anything can be changed.  I have done it for the CTf mod and that includes moving SAR positions and eliminating center spots all together.  So to say that it cant be done isnt correct.  In either event, again, you do not need IGOR to change these as Mr. Lothario knows now and so do others.  but by changing the center spot will definitely create more stuff to change and we should probably go with what is there for us now.

No offense Mysterio but you shouldnt be even talking about Ghost recon.  You were against Ghost recon from day one and now it seems that since no one is really mentioning Rogue Spear you decide  to open you're mouth and make it sound like you give a shit about this community, which in turn you clan whore, you dont.  So plz, STFU and dont say anything until you play a full season of Ghost recon, cause you're poll and word on this subject is completely worthless Mysterio.

+MOD+Saberian

Well Fusion, as for Aramarth's idea, unless he can keep the  mod small like warzone is I dont think a bigger mod should be introduced into cb style gamplay, because the more chagneable script that is there, the more hacking and more cheating that can be accomplished by other players.  In either event, the bigger the mod, the more someone can modify it.  So let's just keep it simple if we are to introduce a new mod to the gameplay.  But then again, if Aramarth can make a mod with one page of script like Warzone then what the hell, i would give it a shot.  
     It seems that everyone has differing opinions on how a cb should be played.  To be honest I think we should just deal with the way we play cb's as it is.  it seems that there will always be someone that bitches about one thing or another.  That cannot be helped, and it seems that going with the masses in this area is mute because it seems that too many people have differing or opposing ideas, so in either event there is no choice of the masses.  I think one thing that everyone can agree on is less bitching should be  used in gameplay and on the forums about cb's.  It seems that the losing clan is always the one that bitches during a cb season, and the main reason they bitch is beacuse they lost cause they were out played in one way or another.  Warzone is the only way I have seen so far that creates the least amount of problems when it comes to having a cb Style introduced into DAMN BL.  Although I must admit that keeping the cb ladder the way it is wouldnt hurt me too much.  The only real issue I have is about the points system.  
     It seems that warzone, because it uses the center spot that is supplied by the original map creates a few issues with availability to get to smoke from certain areas of the map.  Well, like Coke has said in another post, The warzone can be changed, but again, that involves making a new map.mis file for each map that needs to be modded.  
     Hmm, this actually brings up a good point.  Who is to say that we cannot get a mod that changes all the smoke spots to more correct locations for all ghost recon Players.  In reality, all we would need to do is replace the original files with the modded ones with the only thing changed is the center spot.  That would completely fix the Warzone problem, and at the same time all other games would be able to be played with success.  Anyway, if you guys want me to work on that let me know.  Cause that would actgually eliminate the problem of making it a whole mod to add the files to the Wazone mod and it would just be a seperate addon for cbing.  Maybe even get Aspyr to agree to using it as a update for Ghost recon for the Mac

+MOD+Saberian

Sab, with all due respect, I jsut came here and saw a arguemnt and thought I would help out. It isn't the ppl that play GhR I dislike, it's the gameplay that doesn't suit me. This arguement needs not a season of experience to talk about, some people want it some don't.  My poll was logical where others failed.

I personally don't see where this hate comes from. Last time I checked we didn't have any real "bad blood". And my stance on GhR has been neutral, I don't think a game sucks because it doesnt suit me. Its superior graphics wise, no doubt, and for some it does have better gameplay. And in most ways has a more realistic feel.

And I do give a shit about the *DAMN community, be it GhR or RS, they have carried all the weight of a community. Don't make me sound worse than I am...yes I am a clan whore...and proud of it... but is there a need to start flaming.

Perhapes Sab, you need to think before you open your mouth, you acomplished nothign in that post other than a pittiful atempt to start a flame war. I was merely helping a arguement otu of a dealock. If you disagree simple say so, no need to turn into The Grinch.

 Sab, I'll do my best to show you more respect than you showed for Myst.

What don't you shut the fuck up and take a look at past issues - some of the best ideas come from people who aren't really involved. People like Myst who don't play Ghost Recon can present new ideas, and someone find a simple solution for problems that religious players can't solve.  

I didnt start this post to have ppl flame eachothe and piss each other off, I just wanted to know what ppl thought about moving the wz for IF the mod will be used. Thanks Eight for your succinct opinion thats the kind of length replies i was hoping for.

SAB, ty 4 offering to "mod" the mod (no pun intended) but the guy who wrote it has offered to so mb he should do it...

I still havent had any opinions on where the wz should be moved to if at all.

Yours Still waiting hoping to not be flamed

C o k l e b e r r y Finn

Flames Coke....... ;D

Yes lets keep this tread flame free plz.. its a good dicussion!!!!!

WoW...moving all the WZ threads in to one made it all pretty confusing, I dont know whats a reply to what...

Anyway, WZ is a incomplete mod. When some one gets the base the text says that blue team got it, the smoke is yellow and....arrgh..well i never know who has the base.

And the game dosent allways end when the all the enemys are eliminated (what if you killed the opposing team, thought games was over and started shooting around on own team cause you were so happy ;D ....could happen)

LMS is the queen game mode, the one and only, the true cb mode
dont change it mauti :)

Flames Fusion ;D

So I wont email majorplaying then.......
mind itd be quite fun to have a diffeerntly place WZ just 4 normal games wouldnt it? im gonna email him anyway. FU lot
=p
coke

add both
lms and warzone