*DAMN R6 Forum

I would like to take about 10 -15 minutes to talk about something that's REALLY been bothering me.

what hell are people's problems? ?This message is to anyone who makes fun of or rags on Canadians for no reason at all. ?You guys have no idea how much shit we go through. ?People have no idea about Canada and most have never been there yet they talk all sorts of shit and say really mean things when they know nothing. ?Canada isn't ANY different from the US. ?Sure the currency might be worth a little less, but we drive cars just like you. ?We don't live in igloos, and we don't say aboot. ?Now this isn't to all Americans, but the ones who feel they have to put down others to make them think their "oh-so-great" country is better. ?It's really pathetic because i come down to the US and get all sorts of shit about being Canadian, but when Americans go to Canada people don't say "oh you useless american" because they are nice and they aren't a bunch of stuck up assholes who have their heads so far up their asses that they don't realize the whole world just wish they would go to hell and stop butting into other people's business.

Canada doesn't have any enemies nor allies. Well that's an overstatement but the point is that they mind their own business. ?They leave the world alone and the world leaves them alone. ?This is something this country has yet to learn. ?The world has problems, and the US isn't doing ANYTHING to help. ?The only thing the US did in the middle east was piss them off even further. ?This country is pathetic, they raise their kids to think that they are the best and that no one else matters, that they are morally and physically better because they are from the USA. ?The people in Canada have pride in their country, but they aren't dick heads about it. ?They aren't overly proud to a point where it becomes ridiculous. ?The US does lose sometimes, yet they never admit it. ?On Sept. 11th they lost big time, they Lost. ?No matter if they kill every terrorist in the middle east, they have lost. ?Do you see planes flying into skyscrapers in Canada? no. ?Are there 10 murders average every day in Canada? no. ?Can you let your two 8-year-old kids walk to school through the city every day knowing they will be safe, in the US? no. ?Can you get an ambulance to your house faster than a pizza delivered in the US? no. ?The atmosphere in Canada is a nice one. ?People love the country because it is a safe and clean place to be, in every respect. ?Canadians have about 1/2 as many daily worries as Americans do, because everyone in Canada does their part to make the country an enjoyable place. ?Canadians are absolutely no different than Americans, and therefore don't deserve to be treated with such disrespect and prejudice as they are in this country.

So now once again, I appreciate the fact that Americans love their country, but you don't need to go shitting on everybody else because of it.

OK flamebait....

Seems you are the ugly Canadian that you say doesn't exist.  

First, Canada has been involved in what's going on in the middle east.. they are part of NATO too....

Second, I've been shit on in the great white north.. it happens everywhere.  Try swinging up to Quebic and not speaking french (ok, they weren't as rude as in Paris.. but still).

Third, an ambulance gets to my house much faster then a pizza.. where the hell have you been in America?  The kids walk to school every day in my neighborhood.... so I don't know what the hell you are talking about.  Stupid, dumbass statements like that will not lend any weight to your argument.  

You are right, Canadians are the same as Americans... We both have dumbasses.

You son of a bitch get a fucking life. You giving us shit after we had planes fly into TWO of our nations great landmarks, and THEN into our nations building of defense. You don't have these problems. Go toot your own fucking horn. You are such a bitch. Who the hell do you think you are steryotyping americans? I don't steryotype Canadians. i know a lot of canadians, I don't know any of them that live in an igloo or say "aboot." What the fuck is your problem? Is patriotism a bad thing? September 11 was arguably the single worst day in America's history so don't being a fucking hotshot saying "THE ONLY THING AMERICA DID IN THE MIDDLE EAST WAS PISS THEM OFF EVEN FURTHER." well guess what dumbass-- THEY PISSED US OFF QUITE A BIT!!!!!

Who the FUCK are you to say everything you just said. You're a fucking hypocrite also. "They leave the world alone." You're not exactly leaving the world alone right now, are you? America is a great country. All I can say is get a fucking life and go piss on your flag. It doesn't matter anymore. You've disgraced it enough already.

:-[                                                      ::)?

I'm sorry everyone, I don't usually get this angry, but this dumbass has allowed me to make an exception.

   |
m|m
\__/                
[    ]          
[    ]          
[    ]____
[_______

Omg, I agree with Grifter and Snipe, You've gotta be the stupidest person that I know, you even pass gorf for that!

I think we all need to calm down here,

this canadian seems to be confoozed.. eh?

any way no need to get all over reacted to this, i mean ya it is his opinion to post retardedly over here, but whatcha going to do eh...

LOL...that's ironic. Gorf lives in my town, and he's canadian. He was the one I was talking about when I said I know canadians that don't say aboot or live in an igloo. lol

:-[                                                           ::)?

Well when I first started reading your post, I somewhat sympathized with you. You make some good points. I'll give you that Canadia (oops, habit :P) is a good country and if I couldn't live in the States it would be near the top of my list of other countries to live in. However, you soon devolved into an ugly Canadian as GRIFT says. You start making unfounded stereotypes about America. Sounds like a case of country-envy to me.

BTW, the reason we rip on Canadia so much is because it's just too easy. Yes, Canadians do talk funny. Listen to a hockey broadcast and hear them say "O-fense" or "aboot" and you will get my point. Also, how can we resist making jokes about America Jr. as the immortal Homer J. Simpsons calls it.

--pauses to consider ripping every single argument in this post to shreds--

ahh, sure. why not?

As Grifter so nicely pointed out, you ARE part of NATO


I'd be willing ot bet that the US gave out more in international aide than any other country on this planet last year.?


Are you saying this is a lie?



I do think we admit it when we lose. When was the last time we didn't admit we lost? CANADIANS didn't want to admit they lost the figure skating BS, and they got their medal in the olympics. talk about not admitting to a loss.


Is the population of Canada the same as the US? no.


Well, i don't know about 2 8-year-olds, but my one 8-year-old brothe walks to school every day.


ok, i cheat a bit on this one, since i live less thana ?block froma ?hospital.


so is it in the US, unless you go into an industrial area. i'll bet canada has it's fair share of industry as well.


As they do in America.


Well, you sure are exactly teh same. you just spent 10-15 minute dissing Americans.
[/color]

***SNiPE salutes anarchy

>I'd be willing ot bet that the US gave out more in international aide than any other country on this planet >last year.?

You'd be suprised what little of our money actually helps people.  Just as much money that we give to others goes to weaponry (which we profit off of as it is our weaponry) as goes to actually help struggling people.  You would be silly to think the fact that we give the most means we help the most.

>Are you saying this is a lie?

Yes, I'd say it is a lie that Americans are the smartest, most moral people on this planet.

>CANADIANS didn't want to admit they lost the figure skating BS, and they got their medal in the olympics. talk about not admitting to a loss.

Do you watch figure skating, I'm guessing not.  Well I do, and the fact that Canada didn't win in the first place is a crock of shit.  They had a reason to get angry (although it was actually the US that didn't accept it, we were the ones making the biggest fuss).

>Is the population of Canada the same as the US? no.

Per Capita there are still more murders in the US than any other leading nation.

>Well, i don't know about 2 8-year-olds, but my one 8-year-old brothe walks to school every day.

I'd feel safe with kids walking to school here.

>ok, i cheat a bit on this one, since i live less thana ?block froma ?hospital.

5-10 min for an ambulance, 45 for a pizza, I think his remark was rather stupid.  And to diss Canada, how do you like your regular dental and doctor visits with your nationalized health care.  Try getting help for problems that aren't emergencies.

>As they do in America.

Ok, this is complete and utter bullshit, hardly any Americans do their part, we are a country of apathetic louts.  Have you looked at voter turnout statistics lately?

>Well, you sure are exactly teh same. you just spent 10-15 minute dissing Americans.

Yes, this was quite funny of him.  Personally, I just think he is a dumbass in how he said stuff, but I believe the US is a shithole and that Canada and most of Europe is better, not financially, but in overall enjoyment of life.

Our last presidential election: 80% turnout

:-[                                                             ::)?

I would like to start by saying, THIS IS THE WORST EXAMPLE EVER OF A CANADIAN!!!!! I find it disgusting to see my country being represent by such a utter asshole! I have alot of friends in the US which i visit very often, I can't see any difference between our 2 ppl. OK, paragraph one wasn't too bad, but the rest is complete bull shit!
Posted by: Oso      Posted on: May 17th, 2002, 1:09pm
I think we all need to calm down here,
this canadian seems to be confoozed.. eh?

Talk about stereotypes. Ofcorse, if I'm Canadian I must said "Eh?"  , "Aboot", and all that shit, guess what, I DON'T. I may not beable to say that about some other ppl in Canada.
I personally know pratically no french, and I visit Qu?bec  and never get anyshit, hell in Montreal most ppl speak english.
And, About american stereotypes, I know all of them are BS.
thank you for your time.

If we don't, who does?


Moral is a thing you can only define for yourself.


I expected this one to get flak, because i know that the canadians were indeed cheated to begin with. And no, i don't watch figure skating.



aight, and where do these murders most often occur? near the Canadian border. ;)


My my, aren't we pessimistic? i was referring not specifically to voter turn out, but to being a "Good Samaritan"/not being a criminal. [/color]

I think canada is a fun place to visit, but i wouldn't want to live their  ;D. Seeing how i'm the aimlessly underage drunk highschool kid that the poster is sterotyping, i'd just like to say, why oh why can't we get the drinking age in america to 19 ;). All this stuff aboot canada being dumb is just a joke, get over it. Alot of my clan mates are canadian, and they are very funny and calm.
(i'll like canada alot more when i'm 19) 8)

heh, well well well what do we have here.8)

Mr. Anonymous, i think you are sort of right in some points (being canadian and all:D) but i also think you crossed the line quite more often than not.

Yeah i do wish that i lived in a country that i could be proud of (canada, mexico....) and a place where the lifestyle is more relaxed than the US, But, u shouldn't just go all out dissing the US like that, it's wrong and immoral.  Everyone is proud of their country and u'd probably get shot if you said everything in your post on the street.

They will learn that there's something wrong when the big hole in the ozone layer opens over the US and fries everyone, jk ;)

and uhh no snipe i don't live an igloo that's correct  :D

Try just under 50%

One other stat I just heard.... Guess which city has more bombings then any other in North America... BZZZZZ.. wrong, thanks for playing...

The correct answer is Montreal.  The source is an interesting bomb squad feature on the Discovery Channel I just saw.  They showed the Montreal bomb squad talking about all the bombings they get between the biker gangs that control the drug trade.

Oh, and if anyone is interested, my cottage is in Canada.. and I actually love the place.. just not dumbasses.  I'd live there full time if it weren't for the taxes.

Yes, we do have quite a problem with those biker gangs... 8)

Well, you sir are an idiot. Keep in mind I am not even American. I AM RUSSIAN. Former Communist son of A red Army soldier. Going into the Russian Air Force in 4 years. You seem to not know what America is all about. Sure they can be overly patriotic, visit your country and dress like they want to mow your lawsn, fat, loud-mouthed slobs ;) I am kidding Americans. But they are not all prejedice towards over countries. If they are, they are probablly a high school drop out in the South. Oh and are you part of NATO?(btw Russia joined NATO today)  DO you have your SAS in Afghanistan. Yes, you do. So go be a good boy and shoot yourself

jesus christ ppl
it doesnt matter wether we are canadian or american
what does matter is that we both love our countries
who the fuck cares about crime rates. i cant do ANYTHING about the average murders per day in this country, why should that be counted against me personally? i love my country as much as any canadian,
but god damnit dont hold my dunbass government against me just because i coulnt vote to change it

well said cossak
if we were as predjudiced as he assuses us of being, russia would NEVER be allowed into NATO

Heh, me love my country...that will be the day.  If you were last fall you would know that I consider myself an expatriate, I just happen to still live here.

no countrys perfect. i like it here in america, but im not going to say its a flawless society. sure, since 9/11 some of us have been a weee bit patriotic, but thats not everyone. america is the last superpower in the world, so naturally it has a few more responsibilities then its neigbors. hell, the fricken world ecomony is based on the stability of the american dollar. blah blah blah. yes, ive been to canada, yes i have canadian friends, and yes its a fine country.. but why vomit up all this crap about america to a bunch of rogue spear playing teenagers?? if your opinions are that strong, why not take credit for them? it appears the only person who loves their country so much that they have to shit on everyone else about it is you..

How could we all be so stupid?If this oh-so-great Canadian's gonna stand up for his country "Anonymous" then we should all know that this is one of the IAM poons.Ya know whats funny?They left me on thier mailing list saying that its time to wake up thier clan,and thier plot is done.Whatever the plot is its gonna be a good one.Hows aboot we go down to the stoor and get some cigs eh? 8)

don't get me wrong, i think America is FAR from perfect, but it comes damn close. the trouble is, as long as there is more than one person in any country, there can never be perfection, because people will ALWAYS disagree on something. the only way to achieve perfection would be.. well, if we were all one person. Can you say Borg?

Woah. Wait a sec. Canadians don't live in igloos? They don't say aboot? Next thing you guys will say is that their national flag doesn't have a big fat marijuana leaf on it. Those crazy stoned Canadians.

That said, Anarchy, America doesnt even come close to being perfect. How you can even say that is beyond me.

Thank you Grift and Ace for being the voices of reason. again.

if America doesn't come close to perfect, what nation comes closer?

Some smaller ones (population compared to USA) in Europe are very nice... a lot less crime per capita, not the big swing between rich and poor... Switzerland would be one of them... however, there are trade offs... (they have a much higher suiside rate per capita then the USA too, which is weird)... The US may be flawed, but it still leads the world in many areas like medical care (why so many Euro's come here to have treatment).  Also, things are much more affordable here then in many areas (try filling up your Triumph in England some time... damn are petrol prices high there compared to here).  Hell... try to get a good stake in England....  no offense, but I've traveled there more then anyplace else outside North America (Brazil is a close second).  

Mexico or many of the Caribian Islands are great to live, if you already have $$$....  

But I degress.... it's all in what you are looking for.  Overall I find America a great place...  I live in a city of 120,000 people (that would be voting adults), that has twice that number working in it... (Ford's world headquarters are here.. along with most of it's R&D).  It boarders on a city that held the title of "Murder Capital of the World" for many years as I grew up...  but I think there has been 1 murder in Dearborn in the last 12 years.  We don't even lock our doors here... we don't need to.  Yes, politics and what our government does to the ecology bug the hell out of me sometime, but at least in the US we hear about it, it's not covered up (successfully anyway).  Even if we are not great at helping the rest of the world.. at least we try.  Bondo can say that all that money doesn't do much (I'll disagree and point out plants that were built with it producing fresh water for millions)... But who else is even trying Bondo...?  And I'm not just talking about the Government either, because that's not the sum of the nation.. how about all the causes that middle america donates to?  you know... Feed the Children... Amnisty International....  African Relief Funds...  you saying all those food shipments don't help??

Now, America isn't perfect... but there are many that try...  I do think that Americans are some of the most giving people there are as a nation.... if not, who is?

I never said that private charities don't work in getting the money to help.  I said the government fails largely.  I think the government should stop spending so much freaking money on foreign aid and defense and give us a huge tax cut so that we can give the money to charities that do work.  If the government could handle taxes properly we'd have an extremely low tax rate and have all kinds of money to help charities out.  Now before you start thinking I'm a Republican *shudders* I'm still in support for welfare and other social programs, but I think they should be run by the states under guidelines set by the federal gov.  But I suppose that would be Republican as well and I'm a Green Party member, none of this two party bullshit that we have now.

Lets me start off by saying "jn.blackhand" you make me sick.
It's dispicible that this one idiot started all this! I would like to point out that Americans have a higher drug usage. And Canada has good health care, though we have a bad goverment that exploits taxes and fails to fund schooling.
|AK|*GokuSniper<Sc> you have shown what a ass you can be.
I find this "American Humor" to be worse than The orignal post int he topic. It's very anoying, i bet some of you belive it.
I respect America for their Country and beign a good nation leader, I also don't think they come close to perfect. Canada has tons of problems, we are not near perfect either.
This topic is getting out of hand! Who ever the fuck started this topic i spit on you. I spit on your fathers grave. You may be Canadian by blood, but you are nto Canadian by soul.
? ?|
m|m
\__/ ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
[ ? ?] ? ? ? ? ?
[ ? ?] ? ? ? ? ?
[ ? ?]____
[_______ "Anonymous" Fuck you to hell!

LMAO,

This is completely retarded!!! I wont ramble on and on because we all know America is a great country, regardless of your personal (and I see quite opinionated) feelings.
As for bondo being an ex-patriot..lol I wont even go there..

I love and hate people based on their actions, not on creed, color, religion, origin, or whatever...if somebody is a piece of shit, then THEY are a piece of shit! Not their race, not their country, etc...

Whoever started this, please grow the fuck up and deal with it, don't go throwing around useless misinformation to anger the masses, and get your facts straight before stepping to me...I have and I wiil shut down anyone who talks out of their ass like you.

Now everybody put a smile on and let this thread go, it's useless, and pointless...let these fools drift in the wind.. ?

:):):):) Kilzo

Ok... I let you guys fight this thing amongst each other...
If you threat Canada, you threat the UK or am I still living in the 19th century??
I'm from Europe... duh...
I've been to Canada and the US...
Both great countries!! Nice folks?
Grifter, they aren?t that rude in Paris as in Quebec, but the women in Paris are far more good looking than your sweethearts in the US? 8)

Kilzo, it is expatriate, I wasn't spelling it wrong and it doesn't mean formerly a patriot like ex-patriot would mean.

Beast, aside from my High School which was loaded with babes, I would probably have to agree with you, wouldn't know though having never been to...any other country.  Just a word of advise to everyone, don't go to a commuter college.  It is filled with 50 year old women trying to get a new career, not with 20 year old knockouts like normal schools.

supercalifragilisticexpealidocious ... yeah...
Once again i would like to say that "Anonymous" is a sick freak who needs to grow up and learn that Canadia is not a perfect place either. I was just watching world's wildest videos the other day.  Vancouver lost an important game in some sport...basketball? Hockey? Something.. anyway, there was a huge riot. I thought it was kinda funny that there were canadans rioting. there was this one guy.. looked like a hippie, going through the streets of tear gas and running people and looters, well, he was waving a flag and saying things like, "You're all a disgrace to Canadia, man"

:-[                                                               ::)?

Bondo... this is the quote I was talking about.. you said "our money"... not the governments. ?There is a big difference between thinking that our political system sucks and needs an overhaul... and equating that with the whole USA. ?After all.. the USA is much more then it's government, isn't it?

I mean, I agree.. I don't like the two party system... I'm a member of greenpeace (yes, a tree hugging hyppie freak I am), and think Bush should be hung, drawn and quartered for what he's trying to do in Alaska... but that has little to do with the countries morals or values... ?We probably give more away in private forign aid then our government does (I have nothing to back that up with but a gutt feeling)... ?We send people, and blood and supplies every time there is an emergancy somewhere on the globe.... ?after all.. it is the American Red Cross... ?So, while I understand and agree with many of your beef's with the government we have.... I don't think you give our country enough credit. ?Mind you.. if Hillary ever gets in the White House again (as pres... which was a topic on the news yesterday)... I'lll finish my move to Canada... because she scares me more then Bush....




Couldn't agree with you more Kilzo... Assholes are all the same... brown on the outside and pink on the inside and full of shit.... those are the guys that earn this scorn.. not a nation or creed or race.

Beast... I can't say the girls in Paris did it for me... now, the girls in Toronto and Montreal though.... wow.  I'll sit in a coffee house there and just watch the parade of nothing but beautiful women go by...

Sniper.. that was a few years ago, after a hockey playoff loss.  Plus, don't forget the riots when the G3 conference was there last year... (notice nothing happend here in Detroit with it two weeks ago).

Myst.... you need to get some facts correct... isn't BC producing more pot then anyone else right now in north America??  Doesn't Montreal have a large drug problem??  And as for health care... wait until you grow up a little and have a few operations... or spend some quality time in hospitals in both countries.... then let's talk about health care.  Canadian health care isn't bad.. but it's not up to par with US health care (it's the catch 22 of socalized med... everyone gets it.. but no money for research).  If you compare the problems in Us and Canadian cities of the same size, you'll find many of the same problems... you can't compare Toronto or Ottowa or Montral to New York or LA.... they just don't stack up.  Hell... I think the subburb I live in is bigger then Windsor.  

Again, don't get me wrong, I love Toronto and Canada... I just don't like people that confuse the facts.. on either side of the river.

Well, I have a distaste for Americans in general as well, just not as much as the government.  I mean if the success of reality shows, the abundance of exploitive crap on Fox, and wrestling doesn't show you that American's are a shallow stupid group, I don't know what will.  Still, I think if we could just get Ralph Nader into office we could make some of the necessary changes.  I think the US has the potential to be an outstanding country, but we will never acheive it without major changes from the government, and those won't happen without Americans getting their act together because the Democrats and Republicans won't do it.  I despise both parties and it really pissed me off when people said, I don't like either candidate so I voted for the one I dislike the least.  There are more than two candidates on the ballot, find one you do like and vote for them just to show that you aren't going to vote one of the main two parties just because they are the only that would likely win.  Just because you don't pick the winner doesn't mean your vote is wasted, every vote for the Green Party helps establish it more in the political realm.  If they could only get 5% they could get governmental campaign help.  But that gets into campaign financing and this post is long enough as it is without me going into that.  Who said I post short one line replies again?

DAMN IT! Someone close this damn topic, plz!!! :o :o

Ok Bondo, but what country is more giving... or more caring... or does more for others?  Where is this uetopia?

As for Fox and TV... I've watched TV elsewhere... since I am decently traveled.... and it's not any better anywhere else that I've seen...  LOL.. watch TV in Japan sometime... or England.  It's different, because their culture is different... but I wouldn't say it's more moral... it's just different.  BTW.. WWF (or WWE now I guess) is pretty freaking big in Europe and Australlia too... so let's not think this is an American vise...there are red necks everywhere.

It's one thing to slam on the government.. another to slam on the people.  It doesn't matter which country you go to, You'll find both good and bad people...  But then again.. if you really are an expatriot... what's keeping you here now?  I mean, thousands come to the US every day legally... why not go to Europe and start off, you are at the exact right age for it?  Me and my buddies traveled Europe at your age with no money (poor college students staying in youth hostles for $1.25 a night)...  anything can be done if you want it bad enough.

mysterio, is sarcasm beyond you? sorry, but putting in sarcasm brackets defeats the purpose of being sarcastic. sigh.

anarchy, I'm not saying there is one perfect nation. Saying America is close to perfect is simply wrong. Look at poverty, drug usage, violence, etc. Take a drive through any major city and I'm sure you'll find plenty of things that are wrong with the US.

Being a world power is not synonymous with being a good nation. Countries like Iceland and Canada may not have nuclear weapons and major sports leagues, but we (the USA) could learn something from them.

the only perfect society is on the north pole
no people, no problems

I think that this is a stupid topic..Canadiens never make fun of Americans?  How could you really care?  Its over the computer..it's a joke..it's not real life we people are torturing you.

i think what your saying is a big hunk of BS!
and why anonymous ? are you AFRAID?

No land either, just a lot of frozen water.

Out of all the countries in the world, Russia would be closest to perfect. Maybe even perfect. I mean with all our rights living under a utopian sociotey being controlled by a person who controlled the East German Stassi and KGB. Ahhh the brillant tactics and stratageies being developed by our brilliant commanders in Chechnya. In case you have not known that I was being sarcastic. America is no where near close to perfect. I will give you the Russian view of your bitch government. You back down from the ballistic missle treaty, you exploit our oilfeilds on the Ob river and then bitch about it when we forbid your companies from operating there. You send weapons and money to the Chechen Rebels under the pretext that they are being illegaly occupied by a forign power, and yet you suppport Isreal. I say boo to Sharon, he is a bitch that needs to be raped and then sat on by Oso. Israel kills Palestinian civillians. They even torpedoed the U.S.S. Liberty in the Sea of Aqaba duing the 1967 War, Youre shit government covers it up. Then you tell your puppet U.N. to kick the Russian troops out of Georgia who are acting as peacekeepers. You then replace it with U.S. Army Rangers. How would you feel if we put or troops in Canada or Cuba. Oh wait we did. While you had missiles pointed at us in Turkey. However your governemnt is shit. Bush is a massive tool. But who does not like brittney spears. Oh sure maybe some feminist. Even Al Quada does (they just don't want to admitt it) American cars like the Mustang are the shit, they free spirit of your people, your movies are awesome. THE SIMPSONS KICK ASS!!!! What I am tring to say in my long Grifter-like statement is that Americans are cool. Hell Rock and Roll is the best type of Music invented. HAs taken Eastern Europe and Russia by storm in the Last Decade. Fuck Tchikalvsky I wanna listen to some fucking Lead Zepplinn!! Holy dog shit I can say FUCKING!!!! American culture is the Bitch! Heh I think I pulled a grifter :)

I don't know what your point about Israel was. ?They have rightful claim to all the land there, Palistine does not. ?No, not for religious reason, but because the British won that area through war and established Israel. ?Palistine was created through bullshit treaty agreements based on the threat of no more oil from the Middle East. ?And before you think that land gained through war isn't rightfully theirs, I'll remind you that every country in existance got its borders through war.

So as long you are at war to take over land from innocent people, its ok? Omg.......

Americans are brainwashed by their goverment about israel, don't try to reason with them.

I don't believe I ever said it is right, I just said that is how it is so Israel has the rights to that land.

And Myst, I know my history well enough to know how Israel came to be, I'm not being brainwashed into thinking that England had the land and used it to form the Jewish state or Israel, that actually happened. ?Plus if you looks at the world you'll see that Muslims are fighting with every other religion practically but the other religions aren't fighting each other so that is helpful to know who is wrong here.

I also believe that the only way there will be lasting peace is if you let them fight it out (naturally Israel would demolish Palistine).  Both sides want to fight, and no peace treaty will stop them.

Remember the Treaty of Balford? Israel does not have the right to the land.
A similar thing on a lower level is happening in Canada witht he Native people. They are taking land using cheap and usally fake legal actions, and ofcorse Canada has to keep them happy. Soon the will make my backyard a new reserve!

GOD BLESS AMERICA...


:)

Being Jewish and all, i think that israel shouldn't take SHIT from ANY country (they are put through a lot of it).  If the US could stay out of Israel and let them handle their own problems then i'd say there'd be no more complaining muslims in about... hmmm.... a week or so.  I agree with Bondo and let Israel and the rest of the middle east fight over it themselves.  (naturally Israel would kick-ass) :D

I live inm Alaska I live near canada and i go there ever year so Anonymous I Dont Give A SHIT I Have never Senn canadains Get shit about being Canadain

the un is not the puppet of the US
NATO is(or was until russia joined, now we have a little resistance to what ever we want to do)
while we may have more influence, we still only have 1 vore in the general assembly
and remember that russia still has a veto in the security council(a permanant veto at that)

Not every counrty has been had bounderies made in by war. Look at Brazil. It was given indpendece by protugal. Frankly Gorf I agree with you. But I want Israeli agents and drug trafficing out of other countries. BTW European Jews are not even decended to  the original 12 tribes of Canaan. They come from a trukic peole called the Khazars that converted to Judaism in the 12th Century. Anyhow. I beleive in the two state philosiphy. Palestine was palestinian for  twothousand years befire it was handed over to the Jews. Then Palestine was aquired in the 1967 war. Caused by Israeli pre-emptive strikes on Egypt Lebenon Jordan and Syria. As I said before it is Israel's meadling of affairs in other countries that pisses me off. Also the simple brainwashing of American citizens by the News media. Clearly the coorporations are pro-Zionist. They are owned by zionist jews. If you look at who owns them and the articles and statements and finacial support they do. You will see they are very biased and pro-Sharon. A bit before the Likud party voted to shoot down the peace process. Do not make me post my college thesis on the Palestine-Israeli subject.

I agree that no one should be in any other countries affairs Gorf, but as I have stated before. Israel should stay outta other countrys' affairs. I think the Muslim's would still complain. After all Sharon sent armed gaurds to the Dome of the Rock. The most holy place in Islam after the shrine at Mecca. It is not only Muslims. 1/3 of Palestinains are Christian. So the constant "collateral damage" caused by IDF forces will continue to spark martyrs.

Brazil got its borders from war, Portugal's war. ?Portugal took the land through war with the natives and then gave eventually gave it to the current country of Brazil. ?But the area's borders were established by war.

Also, I'm not brainwashed by the media, if anything I'm brainwashed by the history books.

All I can say is that thread is turning into a history lesson. Im completely surprised you all know so much about all these countries. Nice job staying awake in class. I on the other hand was in the parking lot getting stoned and trying to get laid. Anyways, thanks for the knowledge, I would go on and on with my 2? on this, but I would get too hot under the collar. I can say however that Cossak seems to have it nailed.

to take bondo's point even further,
our whole human existance is defined by conflict, conflict between the haves and the have nots
to take bondo as an example
he has writing shils, his employers need those skils
therefore he reaches a comprimise. they pay him for his work.
now bondo needs food, the store has food and needs workers therefore bondo gives the store money(which is used to pay workers) and he gets food
war is simply a situation where both sides have no aparent acceptable solution
we all know that any war will have casualties, and if our whole existance is nothing more that conflict then we have no hope of a perfect society.

Lichtensein and Monaco, those countries the size of your neighbothood!!! Those countries have had no wars to shape thier bounderies.

Myst.... don't even go there... now you are talking about my people.

Anything that the Native Americans gain back is RIGHTFULLY theirs.  After all... how many promises and treaties were the Europeans allowed to break with them?  Cheap legal tricks my happy, hairy, white ass!  It just goes to show (Native Americans getting some land back) that the human race can actually evolve if they surive themselves....

 America is great :). ?We ?can do whatever we want, eat whatever we want and say whatever we want :-)

You are kidding yourself if you think we can do whatever we want.  The US is damned restrictive on action, much more than they should be.  You see, for some reason the goverment sees fit to dictate our personal morals through law when it is their job simply to dictate interpersonal actions.

Being a Canadian, Jewish, gorf's brotherish, young boy (man) ... ;D
I kinda agree with him with the whole thing on israel.  i'm not worried about them since they have...the 2nd strongest army in the world.  Please don't flame canada, its quite true that a take a bunch of shit at school each day (we live in america).  I've also heard a lot of crap about canada's army, just cause they don't parade their armed forces around another continent doesn't mean they don't have one!   :o

Lets see Israel invade China, and Russia. I do not think they have the 2nd strongest army in the world. I will be waiting for the IDF to set one foot on our soil. Israel definently does not have the second strongest army in the world. And that is not the question. The topic (thanks to me) was transformed to everyone on the board insulting anounymous to siting some of americas faults and then cause of one of my scentences it turned into Israel Palestinian stuff. I meant to say the American gavernment is the "THE BITCH" but your culture and people are the "shiznat". If you think that I was talking only about or primarily about how Israel treats Palestinans, then you are seriously mistaken.

I fully agree with you there Bondo. Your government even when applying for a VISA (passport not the card) ask you moral questions. You do not know the shit one has to go through to get a student visa.

someone please help this poor peep! :o

Yes as hard as it is to believe, Israel could wreck Russia or China. ?They have the most advanced military technology in the world, and the most well trained delta force and special forces in the world, WAY better than the US. ?We send our marines over to Israel just to be trained.

and of course why don't i pull my usual "gorf" by comparing this to rogue spear. ?When me and my bro take on 10 newbs and own them without being scratched? ?same thing here with Israel. ?It's about the Skillz baby ;) not about numbers :D

I meant by doing whatever we want..we can go where we want, wear what we want..I'm not talking about going around killing people and beating the shit out of people.  Gosh in Afghan they couldn't ever take those scarfs (for lack of real word, no offence) off their heads.

i don't pay attention to this sorta stuff, but doesn't isreal get its military equipment from the US?

and i think you mean turban ;)

Israel and the US are allies.  So yeah sure they get some benefits from the US, but they can supply their own weapons and they don't really need the US's help.  They were doing just fine before they came in.  Note: pretty much all the bad stuff has happened since the US moved into the middle east.  I mean, i am positive that Sept. 11th would never have happened if the US never went into the middle east.  Although something like it probably would have happened to another country (Israel)

LoL no Matt the turban is the big rolled up white thing.  I have a bunch of Muslims in my school and they wear like these scarf things down there heads.

 i ment to ask this a few pages back, where the hell is anom.
he started this thread, he shoild be in here duking it out
or is he...

I understand that, but you are still wrong, we aren't allowed to do drugs, we aren't allowed to solicit prostitutes, homosexuals don't have equal rights as heterosexuals, bigamy is not allowed.  These are all victimless crimes that the goverment has no right to make illegal.  They are allowed and encouraged to outlaw murder, rape, robbery and such because they are not victimless crimes, they are crimes that violate the rights of others.  It is like Thomas Hobbes said, it is the duty of the state to act as an arbitor of the people.

so true BOndo  :o :o

School is the wrost they take most of your freedom of speach and other rights in the Constitution away it sucks

Casper, I don't know your situation, but I'm willing to bet good money that you really have no basis for what you just said.

Bondo, you say the government is "allowed and encouraged" to make laws about murder, rape, etc. They are allowed to make a law about pretty much anything, as long as it is Constitutional, even "victimless" crimes. They have plenty of right to make crimes against using drugs, bigamy, etc. If you don't like it, vote them out, stage a political protest, or move.

I did say I'm an expatriate didn't I  ;)  But about voting them out, that is somewhat hard as the electoral process is screwed up in favor of them.  The campaign financing and electoral college both are not favorable to new competition.

I am about to flame this guy. OMFG this is what I mean by stupidity. This juvenile has no idea what he is talking about. He is saying the their Special Forces and small army (not even a million in size) can invade the whole of Russia or face the million of troops china will put up.Special Fores will do nothing against a nuclear barrage Gorf you need to know how the world works. I am sorry but when someone insults my country like that saying that some pitiful desert country of 8 million people could invade Russia and China. Oh and by the way. If it was not for U.S. massive military aid in TRAINING and WEAPONS Israel would be full of citrus growers. Your economy and your advanced army depends on U.S. I do not think the U.S. will support an invasision of those countries. You have a hard enough time controlling people in an area the size of my fist! West Bank ain't that big.

speaking of the electoral college, that is one venerable instuion that needs to retire.
it is the ONLY reason we have bush as president insted of gore(gore won the popular vote not bush) also campaign financing is not a reason these people stay in office(a contributing factor, yes, but not the whole reason) campaign finane laws have been passed(and sumerialy gutted by the majority of corperate puppets) in order to fix his system we need to cut canidates off from the massive bankrolls of their political parties. we also need to stop the soft money hole, cus if we dont then eventually the government by the people, for the people, and of the people will perish from this earth.

Cossak, he was right when he said Israel had better Special Forces than the US, so does the UK.  We do provide military equipment though.  The US doesn't do any training of UK or Israeli SF groups.

So true you can't say anything in school.  I was sent down to the office today for saying asshole and this girl that was cursing at me got sent down for saying fuck :)

poor cossak...just because they (Israel) don't march their army across the middleeast doesn't mean they don't have one or a big one.  Same thing goes with Canada.  At school, people (dumbasses) ask me if Canada has nuclear weapons, or if they have space technology, or if they have an air force.

btw, gorf or i never insulted (well, i know i didn't) the U.S. so take ur flames elsewhere......u cowboys  ;)

You know what, screw it. No one is gonna convince me that Israel will take over Russi and China, that is not what I even wanted to talk about. I am not gonna convince you of my view. So lets drop it. Special Forces cannot take over a country in my opinion.

 exactly, cossac
spec forces are not for occupations, they are more for surgical strikes against stragetic targets

Gorf, Colin...

It's good to have pride in your jewish heritage and in Isreal... but don't let pride go to your head.  All the training in the world wont let 1 guy beat 100... let alone 1000.  

Isreal is a country about the size of New York City in population... put it in perspective.  

"Most Advanced Military Technology in the world"...  sorry, wrong there too.  They do have a small pile of nukes now.. but not the big boys.  Also, all those jets that the US sell to Isreal are a step down from what the US keeps (the F16's with the Star of David on them are missing a few bits of electronics compared to the ones the US flys).  Also, the Isrealies don't have stealth fighters, bombers, etc...  then talk about their tanks, big guns, spy satellites (opps, the use the US's mostly)  Sorry.. the US, Russia and China all have as good or better tech then Isreal.  And many more people to fight with it.

Yes, if you want to rescue hostages or assinate some terrorist, I'd want some Isrealies to do it for me... but there's a big difference between spec warfair and a war (ask any Americans that were around to see Vietnam).

So just don't turn this into a "my dad can beat up your dad" argument....

And anyone that thinks that 9/11/01 was due to the US's involvment in the middle east must really not read much...  First, there have been attacks on the US for almost 30 years there (I know most of you don't remember our embassy being taken hostage.. but tell me you've read about it please!)  

Also, don't think that Isreal is completely innocent either... they haven't really looked for peace either.  And the boundries aren't the same as they were in 1947 either... they've been expanded quite a few times.  No, I'm not anit-Isreal.. just being realistic.  Nobody out there is a saint.

Israel may be small but its still got a whoo[ing army know why?  Every citizen at the age of 18 goes into the army for 4 year...so there  >:(






ps: my dad can own urs   ;D ;D ;D  jk

Yes Colin, I did know that... did you know that they are not the only country that does it??  After all... ask the Russians... or the Austrians....  or the half dozen other countries the conscript their armies still....

How many 18-22 year olds do you think there are in Isreal anyway?  As many as in those other countries?  As many as in the US Armed Forces (think again).

Like I said, it's good to have pride, but know what you are talking about.

I almost got drafted into the Russian Army a month ago. Maybe two I forget, anyhow Israel as Grifter says is not the only country that does that sort of thing. Hell now back on subject of the original post. HEY MISTER ANOUNYNMOUS WHORE!!!

        |
    |mm|
      |   |
      |   |
      |   |                from your freind, ??ss??k

not quite grifter....


Quote:[/u]

The increase in Israel's combat clout comes less from size than from other, intangible factors. For instance, Israeli technicians have added digital and other improvements to their F16 fighters, making them even more capable than versions used by the U.S. Air Force, Brower said.

Israel's air force, which flies souped-up U.S. F15 and F16 fighters, can complete nearly 3,000 combat missions per day. The United States can carry out about 1,600 missions a day. That has given Israel vast freedom of action, not just against Palestinian street fighters, but against its traditional rivals, Syria and Egypt, as well.

And Israel has a huge pool of seasoned combat pilots. Its air force can use one aircraft again and again while exchanging fatigued pilots for fresh ones. The United States does not maintain as many combat pilots per airplane as Israel.

Israel relies heavily on its reserve forces. There are almost a million Israelis younger than 48 liable to be recalled to duty. All have done three years' active duty as well as reserve training. Reserve troops are organized into units already matched up with vehicles and weapons.

"It's one of the most efficient military forces around," said Anthony Cordesman, a senior analyst at the Center for Strategic and International Studies in Washington, D.C. "Can they thumb their nose at us? Well, for a while."

Well... Having more pilots then plans was a problem that the Iraq airforce had as well... after most of the aircraft were lost on the ground...  and notice your quote doesn't talk about numbers... how many plans do you think each side will have in the air at the same time?

Military Technology...  You hear of any F22 Raptors over there... or Steath fighters or bombers...  or a few other things that you know the US government hasn't let show yet...  Remember... The F15 and F16 are how old?  And the F117 was around for how many years before the US let people see it?  One things for sure...  if they let you see the F117, then you must know that there is something much hotter hiding behind closed doors.  

Look, I'm not trying to disrespect the Isrealies... I think they have a major fighting force... They probably compare better then most European countries...  but to think that they could walk into the US, Russia or China is just delusion.  Never forget the lessons of World War's I and II... when the US mobalized over 4 million (and the country was much smaller back then in population).  Don't even talk about how many Russians were fighting.... And as for superior military technology... if they were that superior they wouldn't be tweeking electronics in 20 year old US fighters, but building and flying something better (Like that fine Russian aircraft the Mig 29... which is much better then the F15 in many ways).  And most importantly, if it wasn't for American Aid to Isreal... they wouldn't have the tech they already do...

Can Isreal hold it's own against the other countries in the Middle East.. sure.  Can they hold their own against the true world powers.. sure, till the last man falls... even if they killed 3 o 4 to 1 against China... it's not like China would notice (or care much, the way they fight).  

grift, the US definately has things behind closed door, but ur forgeting that irael may have closed doors of their own.  btw, when did i say that israel could invade russia, or china, or the US?  i don't remember saying that.  All i said was that Israel has the second strongest army in the world, which i will prove.  i will get a quote and a link for u soon that proves what i say.   ;D

Stop stealing my middle finger design!!! argh...

? ?|
m|m
\__/ ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
[ ? ?] ? ? ? ? ?
[ ? ?] ? ? ? ? ?
[ ? ?]____
[_______ ?? ?

E'hem. Well anyhow who is to say. Only way to tell what happens is to do it. Unfortunently that might result in the end of the world. Oh by the way. Check out this little airplane. I am not thumbing my nose at people I am just sayng it manuvers are awesome. http://www.artbell.com/video/su37.mpg ? ? ? ?You might not be ble to understand the words, but seeing a plane do manuvers like that is international. Oh btw snipe:
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?|
? ? ? ? ? ? |mm|
? ? ? ? ? ? \ ? ?/
? ? ? ? ? ? ?| ? |
? ? ? ? ? ? ?| ??| ? ? Cossack Corporation 2002

To me it is not a question if Israel's military is strong, but is it being used morally. When one goes into a refugee camp or bombards Palestinian civilians with F16s in the Streets. Notice how many more Palestinians have died. A lot more even if you minus the suicide bombers. Colateral Damage can really piss people off. They really do not like being bombed on accident repeticiously.

all i can say is damn cossac that is one cool little plane
the vectored thrust is what makes that all possible too
i wonder if the f22 can do that(my guess would be yes). another thing i was questioning was the combat effectivenss of those manuvers
i'm fairly shure that an f16(or f15 i'm not 100% shure) could pull off those vertical stalls(it has a thrust to weight ratio greater than 1 so it can fly straight up)
but any way, that was a highly impressive show for any plane to do

Very cool little movie Cossak.

I've seen one just like it showing the F-22 doing some of those same manuvers. ?If Discovery Wings is to be believed, the F22 can actually vector it's thrust enough to stop and fly backwards for a short distance. ?The F-22 doesn't use the "Turkey Feathers" that the SU-37 uses, but a radical looking exhaust that is a rectangle.

And while the F-15 is the only plane in the world that can accelerate at 90 degrees up, it's can't do the stall... ?without the vectored thrust, it's too hard to recover from (or so it has been said). ?Both the F-15 and F-16 have the "Turkey Feather" exhaust, but it's only to change the shape of the exhaust gasses to make them faster.. it doesn't change vectors much at all (compared to planes like the Raptor or that Su. ?Don't forget, those planes were built in the 70's and are older then most of us (me included).

As for the Isrealies haveing things behind closed doors... I doubt that they have anything that is a leap-frog over these planes, considering that they are buying, not building their military still.  Sure, they may be developing something... but most countries havn't been able to copy the Stealth planes yet... what makes you think they can come up with something better (when they haven't produced anything at all yet)?  I mean, you know that America has planes much better then the F-117 hiding away, being tested... since no other country has even duplicated that, what in the world makes you think they have the knowhow to create something better?  It's not like any other country spends the money on research that the US does (I'm sure Russia and China are in spots 2 and 3).  Hell, China is in the same boat as Isreal... they get most of their tech from Russia (or did).  The deal with China is that they will spend millions of lives to win a war... I mean, they've shown that in the past, and they have more people then anyone else (by far).

a few well placed daisy cutters can fix that problem on the battlefield ;)